RWD Mazda's are on the way.....

[DFB FGXR6]

Have to admit, I'm looking forward to a Inline 6 and RWD Mazda.

https://www.carexpert.com.au/car-new...in-2022-report

"Both the 6 and CX-5 replacements will be underpinned by the previously confirmed Large Architecture and offer inline-six power.............

"..........Displacing 3.0 or 3.3 litres, the new inline-six engines petrol and diesel engines will be available with 48V mild-hybrid and plug-in hybrid technology."

[simon varley]

there is already a rwd Mazda. It's called a BT-50

[Fordman1]

I’m sure Mazda will be really happy about supplier employees leaking info about Powertrain plans (if true).

[jaydee]

Yes please, and bolt on a turbo.

[randel]

6 cylinder large RWD sedans??? No-one wants them anymore! - Well thats what we kept getting told about Falcon and Commodore? ****ing ironic isn't it...

[MITCHAY]

A RWD Mazda 6 has me interested.

[prktkljokr]

Zoom Zoom

[NX74205]

I might be interested in a luxury top-spec four seat 'Atenza LE' (like the latest CX-9 Azami LE).

[Dr Smith]

Could this be the closest to a Territory replacement as the Kluger is FWD biased as I imagine the new Jeep GC's will be more expensive when they finally release details on the all-new "short wheelbase" version?

[lra]

A luxury RWD sedan with a 186 and 202 cubic inch in-line six cylinder. Name suggestion, Mazda 'Premier'.

[cheap]

Originally Posted by simon varley

there is already a rwd Mazda. It's called a BT-50

MX-5 (all generations)

[Dr Smith]

Originally Posted by randel

6 cylinder large RWD sedans??? No-one wants them anymore! - Well thats what we kept getting told about Falcon and Commodore? ****ing ironic isn't it...

The difference here is the Mazda Cx-9 and 6 sedan are internationally sold. Also if true, reports suggest Toyota will also be using the inline diesel so you have a much larger production volume and maybe even Toyota money for R&D.

[Bossxr8]

Depends what sort of power they make i guess. And what the styling looks like. Not really a fan of their current looks.

If they could somehow make it sort of look like a bigger 4 door FD RX7, then yes please.

[CyberWasp]

Mazda knew RWD was better in 1979 with the 626.
It took all this time to go full circle.

[oldel]

RWD isn't the (whole) story. Mazda kept rwd for MX, RX, truck, utes, vans etc.

Anyway, this was news months ago, but I have to point out I would be less suprised with them announcing their first ever v8. That would make more sense for packaging reasons, or even easy cylinder de-activation.

Big story is them doing an i6 (forget the RWD part for now). I wonder what they see in it? They've never ever done a i6 before, only v6. And of course they could easily do a FWD v6 and keep in their comfort zone. Big risk as mazda hasn't ever done an i6, and there's all sorts of downsides of it - longer bonnet, worse crash protection I expect unless passenger room suffers, requirement for rwd. All of this adds massive cost and compromise so I wonder what they see in it for a modern car? Toyota and nissan dropped the i6 ages ago, same for merc and I feel bmw waning (they started with 4s, have a new drive for v8s, they're losing i6 love I think but keep them around for uniqueness/marketing only).

Don't forget toyota made one of the best i6s from japan in the past and even they had to recently refer to BMW on how to do a modern i6. Yet mazda has never done one before - the rwd isn't the big deal - though necessary for an i6.

Of course I love it - I love the i6 (why I have fords and bmws) also mazdas attitude to experimentation and innovation. I think they want to take on BMW and the rest of the euros if they make a modern day i6 for sure.

[jstanovic]

Originally Posted by CyberWasp

Mazda knew RWD was better in 1979 with the 626.
It took all this time to go full circle.
image

My brother had a white 1981 model, reliable, slow but had the best shifting manual gearbox I’ve ever driven...

[oldel]

Originally Posted by jstanovic

My brother had a white 1981 model, reliable, slow but had the best shifting manual gearbox I’ve ever driven...

Oh for sure. I worked on rotaries exclusively until 1998. Mazda gearboxes have the shifter bolted into the rear extension housing directly (toyota did the same I think - al least for the celica ones I saw). Just one internal rod from the shifter via a single bush did everything.

Every time I think of a man trans I think of that style. Every time I see some USA or euro man trans that is a shoebox sized thing with a remote shifter and external linkages and levers it blows my mind.
Every single time. I don't get it and never will. I can't deprogram myself from what a mazda/toyota 1970s transmission looks like and how they work.

At first I thought only US transmissions were weird with external shifters and remote shifter, but then I found out euro one were the same. So weird and crazy to me - but I spent so many years spoilt with internal shifting mazda gearboxes.

I don't get how everyone else makes their gearboxes so small they don't reach the shifter position, then make everything external so bushes, linkages, dirt/wear etc stuffs up the feel.
It's alien to me, but I guess make boxes as small as possible and invite an aftermarket shifter part industry was a normal policy (outside of mazda cars I guess.) Still blows my mind every time I see a non mazda/celica 1970s gear box, I can't unlearn those expectations for some reason.

E: this is the gearbox I grew up with, it's a mazda rx5 5 speed I put into rx3s and rx4s I had.

It replaced 4 speeds but the gearbox/shifter was also in the extension housing on them too. There's the little middle section for the 5th gear before the extension housing for 5th, so you had to move the motor forward or something before installing a 5 speed in an old car - the only downside of the built in shifter I guess. Reverse mount a 12A engine mount for your 13b 5spd upgrade IIRC
But man gearboxes that don't look like this do my head in, it's all I knew for a decade before buying auto i6s

[Bossxr8]

Originally Posted by oldel

RWD isn't the (whole) story. Mazda kept rwd for MX, RX, truck, utes, vans etc.

Anyway, this was news months ago, but I have to point out I would be less suprised with them announcing their first ever v8. That would make more sense for packaging reasons, or even easy cylinder de-activation.

Big story is them doing an i6 (forget the RWD part for now). I wonder what they see in it? They've never ever done a i6 before, only v6. And of course they could easily do a FWD v6 and keep in their comfort zone. Big risk as mazda hasn't ever done an i6, and there's all sorts of downsides of it - longer bonnet, worse crash protection I expect unless passenger room suffers, requirement for rwd. All of this adds massive cost and compromise so I wonder what they see in it for a modern car? Toyota and nissan dropped the i6 ages ago, same for merc and I feel bmw waning (they started with 4s, have a new drive for v8s, they're losing i6 love I think but keep them around for uniqueness/marketing only).

Don't forget toyota made one of the best i6s from japan in the past and even they had to recently refer to BMW on how to do a modern i6. Yet mazda has never done one before - the rwd isn't the big deal - though necessary for an i6.

Of course I love it - I love the i6 (why I have fords and bmws) also mazdas attitude to experimentation and innovation. I think they want to take on BMW and the rest of the euros if they make a modern day i6 for sure.

Mercedes are using straight 6’s again. No more v6. Jaguar/land rover are now too. They are all switching back to them due to modularity ie they can build inline 4’s and 6’s on the same production line, with many shared parts. Can’t do that with a vee engine.

[Franco Cozzo]

Originally Posted by Bossxr8

Mercedes are using straight 6’s again. No more v6. Jaguar/land rover are now too. They are all switching back to them due to modularity ie they can build inline 4’s and 6’s on the same production line, with many shared parts. Can’t do that with a vee engine.

#Accountants

Discontinue I6 because of cost and design factors.

Bring I6 back due to modularity and cost saving ability

I'd say this was always possible, just that no one thought outside the box about it in finance

[GCRXR6]

Ford to build a new large sedan with an inline 4ltr six, called the Eagle? Nah, just being sarcastic.

[Tickford.]

Mazda building a inline six with RWD as the replacement for Mazda6 is not that big of a secret. It has been out in the news for at least three years now. Plenty of magazines have covered the Mazda I6 with RWD story.

What I hope Mazda does is build something similar to the Vision concept they showed in 2018. That with I6 turbo (petrol) in RWD will have me very interested to add to my current fleet of three Mazda's.

[Dr Smith]

Originally Posted by Franco Cozzo

#Accountants

Discontinue I6 because of cost and design factors.

Bring I6 back due to modularity and cost saving ability

I'd say this was always possible, just that no one thought outside the box about it in finance

I think another point is when commercial times are such that R&D dollars are readily available cost savings such as building an I4 and I6 on the same line are not even considered. There's plenty of $$$, profits are high. Now companies are transitioning to EV's of various forms, sharing development etc... and trying to save as much as possible.

Who remembers the reports (not sure how exaggerated) of when Alan Mullaly joined Ford and found out they made a ridiculous amount of mock-ups of dashboard designs for the F series?

[Sprintey]

I6 and RWD is premium, us Ford fans knew it all along...

JLR 3.0 I6s, this Mazda I6, Merc - happy times

Maybe Mazda can call it the Roadpacer in honour of the HJ

[Sprintey]

The more I think about it, Ford Australia had something really special, and binned it.

[Tickford.]

Originally Posted by Sprintey

The more I think about it, Ford Australia had something really special, and binned it.

Can't say much for the cars, but the latter spec 4.0 I6 Turbo Barra was definitely something special. One of the best engines produced by Ford, or any manufacturer for that matter. Such a shame it died with the Falcon.

Makes you wonder why another manufacturer didn't buy the IP for the I6T? Someone with links to Ford should have purchased the IP to keep the I6T alive and develop it even further. Imagine if Mazda had purchased the rights to the 4.0 I6 and the new soon to be released RWD Mazda6 MPS was powered by a SkyActiv-X Barra! That would be something special.

[oldel]

Originally Posted by Sprintey

The more I think about it, Ford Australia had something really special, and binned it.

They probably knew it. I knew it and they fought hard to keep it so long against Ford USA wishes. They didn't bin it, they pushed it as far as it could go and gave it a good send off by dragging the dinosaur into the 2010s with a good LPG injection for economy option, reliable VCT, turbo as well, and with a zf 6spd to boot.
The cheap 4dr family car spec i6 RWD is not what ford parent company or even buyers wanted. Would have been great in a performance coupe though, but australia doesn't make any. Ford tried hard with the territory to keep the barra alive too. Would have been good in a luxo barge, but no one buys domestic luxo barges (don't sell well enough to keep a company in business)

But ford australia did right by the barra and knew what they had from the dinosaur. Most of us here know, most of the world is finding out as well. Heap of USA interest, even some in europe. Pity the block is so tall it makes fitment difficult in most cars.

[Sprintey]

Yes it was more a binning on behalf of Ford head office in the US

If only they'd done the exact opposite, back in 2006

https://www.caranddriver.com/feature...save-ford-now/

All the great I6s being produced now is also bittersweet to Aussie Ford fans...

[DFB FGXR6]

With all due respect to the Barra, it was a mighty fine engine, but it was just far too big and heavy to have a place anywhere else in the Ford empire.

The engine was taller and longer than more modern designs which would have compromised stricter crash and pedestrian safety scores. And the weight of the extra strong block was not acceptable in modern day weight optimization.

It died with dignity in the Falcon. I would be appalled if it was sold off to a Chinese car company and re-appeared in something very much not a Falcon.

[Bossxr8]

Originally Posted by DFB FGXR6

With all due respect to the Barra, it was a mighty fine engine, but it was just far too big and heavy to have a place anywhere else in the Ford empire.

The engine was taller and longer than more modern designs which would have compromised stricter crash and pedestrian safety scores. And the weight of the extra strong block was not acceptable in modern day weight optimization.

It died with dignity in the Falcon. I would be appalled if it was sold off to a Chinese car company and re-appeared in something very much not a Falcon.

They did trial alloy blocks. From my recollection it would have been done a year or 2 before BA, so if it went ahead it would probably have been used for Barra onwards. Just didn't get up for whatever reason. Most likely due to the casting plant losing a large slice of their business if it happened.

CGI probably would have got a look in further down the track, but I have no idea if the process required to cast CGI blocks could have been done at the casting plant, or whether it required a foundry set up specifically to do it.

I very much agree with you regarding it not ending up in something chinese. That would have been heart breaking.

[Sprintey]

Where, uh, did the Barra tooling go?