Bosch CRD Injectors - Cleaning, Replacement

Citroënbender · 17-12-2022, 11:16 PM

2007 M-B OM646 motor if it’s relevant, 350K, no start. Third party has diagnosed injectors as the reason, with a quote from Mercedes of almost $4K.

Are these practically rebuildable (outsourced) or is new the better choice? If rebuilt, do the rebuilders here typically generate a new correction code or not bother?

Franco Cozzo · 17-12-2022, 11:42 PM

At $4K they're not overly expensive to replace the set compared to other setups, go genuine and program the new set to the car, with how finicky and precise diesel injection stuff is I wouldn't be trusting some rebuild service on this stuff.

I'd be inclined to look upstream and make sure there's no contamination anywhere as well.

Maybe send the old set out for testing to a reputable place which does a proper report before you commit as well.

Citroënbender · 18-12-2022, 05:08 AM

I think it’s well possible to come under that $4K by chasing the OEM part numbers, rather than paying for the Mercedes box. Good suggestion on testing the old ones, struck me as odd that it apparently won’t start/run at all.

Previous owners were a “get in and drive” Level 2 electrical service who use a mobile mechanic for fleet service, I doubt it’s been on a hoist since the end of warranty.

Just looked and it seems the Snap-On Solus can do injector coding. Yay.

Franco Cozzo · 18-12-2022, 01:05 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Citroënbender

I think it’s well possible to come under that $4K by chasing the OEM part numbers, rather than paying for the Mercedes box. Good suggestion on testing the old ones, struck me as odd that it apparently won’t start/run at all.

Previous owners were a “get in and drive” Level 2 electrical service who use a mobile mechanic for fleet service, I doubt it’s been on a hoist since the end of warranty.

Just looked and it seems the Snap-On Solus can do injector coding. Yay.

I've got a bung injector on my Focus thats leaky, if you let the car sit for a week it'll start and carry on like a pork chop at idle until it clears up then it'll run like normal.

At $1100+ GST each injector + having to code them to the car I can't be ****ed spending money on it, but the car will still run.

Find it odd that the car won't run at all, unless there is some smarts there with the ECU that if it detects problems like a misfire scenario it won't run at all.

Thats why I'm curious about sending them off for testing, if they come back and they are operating then it means you've either got:

A) Electrical problem between injector and ECU
B) Faulty sensor/sensor out of range
C) Injection pump halal

If its C then RIP - viking funeral for car.

Something you'll need to be careful about the Bosch part numbers on the injector rather than just paying for the Mercedes box premium is if the Bosch part numbers just refer to the body/series of the injector, they can have different nozzles for flow rates and spray patterns depending on what an OEM wants, this is critical with diesel DI engines as the spray pattern is going to put it in a specific place above the piston.

You'll need to make sure that they are identical to suit that engine/car.

Citroënbender · 18-12-2022, 05:55 PM

This has been sitting for months, it may be possible to get it started but I’ve given all of two minutes to the job this far. My workshop colleague says he has seen the same series of motor with gummed-up injectors wedged in their bores, coke everywhere. I don’t want to get it dragged into the shop until we’ve a handle on costs, time, possibilities.

Re the injector ID, would have thought the last three of the Bosch part number to constitute a really specific unit. Once I know the three digit suffix for the motor it will be easier to check. The free VIN decoders don’t tell me this.

**GasoLane** · 18-12-2022, 06:13 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Citroënbender

This has been sitting for months, it may be possible to get it started but I’ve given all of two minutes to the job this far. My workshop colleague says he has seen the same series of motor with gummed-up injectors wedged in their bores, coke everywhere. I don’t want to get it dragged into the shop until we’ve a handle on costs, time, possibilities.

Re the injector ID, would have thought the last three of the Bosch part number to constitute a really specific unit. Once I know the three digit suffix for the motor it will be easier to check. The free VIN decoders don’t tell me this.

What's the vin, I'll have a dig.

Citroënbender · 18-12-2022, 06:42 PM

Gracias, señor:

WDF63960523267007

**GasoLane** · 18-12-2022, 07:08 PM

Can you pick out an engine type from the drop down list and I should be able to get you a part number............. I hope

Citroënbender · 18-12-2022, 07:21 PM

This is all I can offer on the motor: “ENGINE OM646 DE22LA 110KW (150HP) 3800RPM” and its Euro 3.

It looks like there are multiple options for DE22LA :-/

**GasoLane** · 18-12-2022, 08:15 PM

Here's all I've got on the 4 OM646 DE LA. It seems that you may still have multiple choice but it's the best I can do with what I've got, sorry.

I guess it's too much to ask if there is a data card with the van's paperwork?

A Benz dealer would probably be able to pinpoint the injector better than me.

Citroënbender · 18-12-2022, 08:36 PM

I’m sure all the books are there. I just avoided getting too deep into it the other day, as I was in the middle of some yard work.

Citroënbender · 22-12-2022, 11:27 AM

Found I could get the engine number through ilcats. It’s a 646.982 for which there are three injector listings. Now running, not happily, rear three pots only.

Waiting to see what MTQ offer; depending on level of fiscal comedy, may keep shopping.

Franco Cozzo · 22-12-2022, 11:42 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Citroënbender

Found I could get the engine number through ilcats. It’s a 646.982 for which there are three injector listings. Now running, not happily, rear three pots only.

Waiting to see what MTQ offer; depending on level of fiscal comedy, may keep shopping.

Done compression check on all cylinders?

Citroënbender · 22-12-2022, 11:50 AM

Not yet, injectors still in there. It’s chocked with crud.

Citroënbender · 25-12-2022, 10:13 AM

Redneck rating 8.5/10.

I’d like to see how the alloy castings are in six months - super strong caustic there…

roKWiz · 25-12-2022, 10:55 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Citroënbender

Redneck rating 8.5/10.

I’d like to see how the alloy castings are in six months - super strong caustic there…

I'm surprised any of the wiring is still intact considering that attack.
Merry Christmas

Citroënbender · 26-12-2022, 09:13 PM

No.1 is pretty bad, 2&4 are modestly blowing. There’s good signs of prior work; bruising to the upper flatted sections of the injectors, cable ties on shattered plugs, match marks on injector pipes. I’m making a confident bet the injector retainer bolts weren’t renewed or seal seats properly tidied last time.

Citroënbender · 01-01-2023, 05:24 PM

Clean enough to now identify the injectors. Some of the witness marks and insulation chafing from prior works are revealed, too. First image is 1&2, second is 2&3.

Now starting to wonder if No.3 was the original problem (failure), and more attention given to resolving it than the others, which don’t show the same signs of having been bullied out.

Trying to find an equivalent to the Benz plugs other than Thai fakes. Originals have an LK branding, I was hoping to find a match in the TE Connectivity range through RS Components.

Citroënbender · 05-01-2023, 11:10 PM

UK injector prices are in, with GST, no VAT, and exclusive of actual customs brokerage fees it is about $440 per each new Bosch injector. Estimated three days in transit. No idea what the documentation fees are with the usual freight suspects.

Be interesting to see how MTQ price up in the coming week.

Citroënbender · 12-01-2023, 12:41 PM

The answer is, pretty similar.

A request for those on FB. I’d like to know the lowest prices asked for an 04-10 Vito, as in “need it gone”. Just to be sure the repair isn’t over-capitalising.

Citroënbender · 12-01-2023, 09:16 PM

To put more meat on the bones of that prior post, the injector hold-down threads are stuffed. Moreover, one has stripped out an M8 Helicoil someone previously fitted (they’re supposed to be M6 bolts!). Poor effort; the previous owners might have run a tight ship but thought they were paying for decent work.

If an M6xM12 Keysert type fitting is available locally, this is the only hope short of welding and machining - or a replacement head.

Citroënbender · 15-01-2023, 08:17 AM

Turns out, three rogue bolts from four. Second photo is Helifail coming out of No.4 fixing point. Final image, epoxy slapped onto the cam cover - presumably after Mobile Guy cracked it by levering to remove an injector. The oncosts of rough handling are mounting. :-/

I can’t find any way of approximating the M6 bolt’s factory torque (7Nm+90°+90°) to evaluate thread repair risks. Also a problem is the head being almost impossible to work on “squarely” as 3/4 of it is under the cowl and screen. You could remove the camshaft and girdle to allow more accurate fixing of a jig, but the question of whether it may hold, remains.