Australian Family Cars: We have gone so far backwards since 2016...

[ToryMikey]

So at work today I noticed Bendigo Nissan have a new ad out.

They were plugging the Navara relentlessly. “With up to 140 kilowatts of power!”

And all I could think of was the base Falcon ute (and sedan) eclipsed that thirty years ago. We haven’t just gone backwards since 2016. We’ve gone backwards since 1993.

[Mechan1k]

Originally Posted by ToryMikey

So at work today I noticed Bendigo Nissan have a new ad out.

They were plugging the Navara relentlessly. “With up to 140 kilowatts of power!”

And all I could think of was the base Falcon ute (and sedan) eclipsed that thirty years ago. We haven’t just gone backwards since 2016. We’ve gone backwards since 1993.

And LPG ones at that.
Got the most I could out of my AUII and BFII utes ... for courier work ... and daily use on the property as well.

And my Territory's as well.

looking back ... picked my September 2016 SZII TS RWD Barra ... for $39,000 drive away.

can't get a "half decent" hatchback for that now. Literally.

Sad times we live in

I'd like to get myself something manual as a toy before there is nothing left. I doubt I will get that chance either.

[ToryMikey]

Originally Posted by Mechan1k

And LPG ones at that.
Got the most I could out of my AUII and BFII utes ... for courier work ... and daily use on the property as well.

And my Territory's as well.

looking back ... picked my September 2016 SZII TS RWD Barra ... for $39,000 drive away.

can't get a "half decent" hatchback for that now. Literally.

Sad times we live in

I'd like to get myself something manual as a toy before there is nothing left. I doubt I will get that chance either.

You can get a base model Corolla Hybrid for that price. With the added bonus of waiting a year to get an allocation!

[Sprintey]

Originally Posted by ToryMikey

So at work today I noticed Bendigo Nissan have a new ad out.

They were plugging the Navara relentlessly. “With up to 140 kilowatts of power!”

And all I could think of was the base Falcon ute (and sedan) eclipsed that thirty years ago. We haven’t just gone backwards since 2016. We’ve gone backwards since 1993.

Totally, I think the AU had 157kW...

I think I've found one family car that might come 'close' to what the Aussie cars had in value and size - the Mazda 6 wagon. Entry level is about 42 onroad (list 35K apparently) and this might have been Fairmont/Calais 6 money toward the end, although its in today's trashed dollars so relatively cheaper - Mazda does have stock, I guess they prioritise Australia.

You get a biggish wagon, only a 2.5L 4cyl as opposed to a 6cyl. There is a turbo if you pay more.

It's not an SUV, so goes against the grain with better handling potential and more space at less dollars. And Mazda has just said they will continue to supply it to the Australian market. It may be old but it's well built and they have a good reputation here, too. Good on Mazda for continuing to offer it at the price.

https://www.carexpert.com.au/car-new...axing-in-japan

[Mechan1k]

I managed to get my 6 "fresh off the boat" as a Vic dealer ordered in every colour during COVID
I didn't really have to wait for it .... I just watched quietly and got what I wanted thankfully.

At least I didn't have to wait 5 years for a Whitegoods Toyota.

One thing about even the base Mazda 6's ..... they have a lot of safety tech in them without having to jump up to higher models ... something that was not in the Last Falcons.

I got my 6 Atenza Sedan for $51K inc. onroads in mid 2022.
The turbo model punts along nicely and you can use E10 in it as well.

The N/A is not bad around town really ... it's noticably lacking out on the open road though.

But for a decent reasonably priced base family car ... you really cant go wrong with them.

[ToryMikey]

Originally Posted by Sprintey

Totally, I think the AU had 157kW...

I think I've found one family car that might come 'close' to what the Aussie cars had in value and size - the Mazda 6 wagon. Entry level is about 42 onroad (list 35K apparently) and this might have been Fairmont/Calais 6 money toward the end, although its in today's trashed dollars so relatively cheaper - Mazda does have stock, I guess they prioritise Australia.

You get a biggish wagon, only a 2.5L 4cyl as opposed to a 6cyl. There is a turbo if you pay more.

It's not an SUV, so goes against the grain with better handling potential and more space at less dollars. And Mazda has just said they will continue to supply it to the Australian market. It may be old but it's well built and they have a good reputation here, too. Good on Mazda for continuing to offer it at the price.

https://www.carexpert.com.au/car-new...axing-in-japan

With those, and the Skoda Octavia range (which I ended up purchasing myself), we do have some options for sure. Big props to those two manufacturers for still offering wagons as well, the only other option is the BMW 3 Series which is a whole different price range these days (not to mention their extortionate 13% financing).

[Mechan1k]

The VRS Models are a nice bit of kit as well in the Skoda Range

[ToryMikey]

Originally Posted by Mechan1k

The VRS Models are a nice bit of kit as well in the Skoda Range

Yeah and for 56k with the lux pack (that gives you all the fruit) they're pretty unbeatable. Cooking models can be had for low 40's with leather and the dealers seem willing to do deals and have stock on hand. 6% financing also helps too. You're paying more on your home loan.

[Mechan1k]

Originally Posted by PG2

Keep in mind, the FG X (all models) was actually cheaper than the B-series. A FG X should have been much dearer than what it actually was but very few people were buying them by this stage. The FG X was not at all profitable.

I am not bagging Falcons, in fact, I still own four of them, two sedans, one wagon and one ute and I love them. If they were still available to buy I would own a brand new one.

I missed this.

In agreeance here ... doubt I would have looked at other models when it was time to move on the FG.

I would have been looking at a new Falcon again really.

I got a good 10+ years out of the FG .... day in day out as a daily for work in Sydney traffic. I did it with ease, and was fun as well. Minimal/cost effective maintenance on it. Had some go to it as well. Did everything I asked of it and more really. And could still sip at low 6L/100km on E10 too .... so cost effective on trips too for what it was.

Both the FG along with my SX and SZII I will use as benchmarks now to see how other cars stack up as time goes on with longer ownership. I can say thankfully I have been blessed with some great Aussie Ford products over the years.

[smoo]

Originally Posted by ToryMikey

With those, and the Skoda Octavia range (which I ended up purchasing myself), we do have some options for sure. Big props to those two manufacturers for still offering wagons as well, the only other option is the BMW 3 Series which is a whole different price range these days (not to mention their extortionate 13% financing).

There’s also the Peugeot 508.
Don’t know what they are like but they don’t look too bad, same platform as the ZB Commodore I think.
Did I read somewhere BMW are doing away with wagons, or maybe it was the 5 series wagon.

[ToryMikey]

Originally Posted by smoo

There’s also the Peugeot 508.
Don’t know what they are like but they don’t look too bad, same platform as the ZB Commodore I think.
Did I read somewhere BMW are doing away with wagons, or maybe it was the 5 series wagon.

I saw a 508 recently and it looked gorgeous! However I think it's plug in hybrid only in wagon form, and can't even be ordered on Peugeot's Oz website...

3 Series wagon is still going strong in Straya, and for the first time ever has an M3 option, which you have to pay $190k for

I think you're thinking of the 5 Series wagon, which is Police only and has been since 2020.

[Warrenk]

Originally Posted by ToryMikey

So at work today I noticed Bendigo Nissan have a new ad out.

They were plugging the Navara relentlessly. “With up to 140 kilowatts of power!”

And all I could think of was the base Falcon ute (and sedan) eclipsed that thirty years ago. We haven’t just gone backwards since 2016. We’ve gone backwards since 1993.

If you are going to make a comparison, do it like tor for like. Compare a top of the range 2016 diesel Territory to the Platnium Everest. Or, if you want to compare small trucks, then compare the Narvara to a 2016 Ranger of Narvara. Cherry picking like you are doing doesn't work because utes like the Falcon and Holden had no competition other than between themselves.

[naddis01]

Originally Posted by Warrenk

If you are going to make a comparison, do it like tor for like. Compare a top of the range 2016 diesel Territory to the Platnium Everest. Or, if you want to compare small trucks, then compare the Narvara to a 2016 Ranger of Narvara. Cherry picking like you are doing doesn't work because utes like the Falcon and Holden had no competition other than between themselves.

That doesn't suit the narrative though.

[smoo]

Originally Posted by Warrenk

If you are going to make a comparison, do it like tor for like. Compare a top of the range 2016 diesel Territory to the Platnium Everest. Or, if you want to compare small trucks, then compare the Narvara to a 2016 Ranger of Narvara. Cherry picking like you are doing doesn't work because utes like the Falcon and Holden had no competition other than between themselves.

Base model Navara vs Falcon/Commodore cab chassis is a valid comparison.
Many buyers will have cross shopped them (along with other utes) back in the day.

[DFB FGXR6]

Originally Posted by smoo

There’s also the Peugeot 508.
Don’t know what they are like but they don’t look too bad, same platform as the ZB Commodore I think.
Did I read somewhere BMW are doing away with wagons, or maybe it was the 5 series wagon.

ZB Commodore was inked before the sale of Opel/Vaxhual to PSA, so its on an Opel platform, the 508 on a Peugeot platform.

[ToryMikey]

Originally Posted by Warrenk

If you are going to make a comparison, do it like tor for like. Compare a top of the range 2016 diesel Territory to the Platnium Everest. Or, if you want to compare small trucks, then compare the Narvara to a 2016 Ranger of Narvara. Cherry picking like you are doing doesn't work because utes like the Falcon and Holden had no competition other than between themselves.

Those vehicles are not at all like for like cost wise. The 2016 diesel Territory cost half what the Platinum Everest costs.

Not to mention - I’m fairly sure many people would have cross shopped a base Falcon/Commodore ute with a base Ranger/Hilux. Actually you’re right, a base Falcon and Commodore ute didn’t have any competition, because they were a much better value proposition than a base Thai ute for anyone that doesn’t go off road!

[anobserver]

Originally Posted by Mechan1k

looking back ... picked my September 2016 SZII TS RWD Barra ... for $39,000 drive away.

can't get a "half decent" hatchback for that now. Literally.

Sad times we live in

I'd like to get myself something manual as a toy before there is nothing left. I doubt I will get that chance either.

Bought an i30 hatchback last year. Overpriced for what it is. Rear space is limited, but ideal for daily use in city driving.

For affordable manual toys, the Toyota 86 or Subaru twin might be worth a look. Rear wheel drive too.

[Sprintey]

Originally Posted by Mechan1k

I managed to get my 6 "fresh off the boat" as a Vic dealer ordered in every colour during COVID
I didn't really have to wait for it .... I just watched quietly and got what I wanted thankfully.

At least I didn't have to wait 5 years for a Whitegoods Toyota.

One thing about even the base Mazda 6's ..... they have a lot of safety tech in them without having to jump up to higher models ... something that was not in the Last Falcons.

I got my 6 Atenza Sedan for $51K inc. onroads in mid 2022.
The turbo model punts along nicely and you can use E10 in it as well.

The N/A is not bad around town really ... it's noticably lacking out on the open road though.

But for a decent reasonably priced base family car ... you really cant go wrong with them.

Thanks for the feedback. What is it's ride and handling like? Any torque steer?

[kypez]

Originally Posted by Sprintey

Thanks for the feedback. What is it's ride and handling like? Any torque steer?

Doubt it has enough power in NA form

[Mechan1k]

Originally Posted by Sprintey

Thanks for the feedback. What is it's ride and handling like? Any torque steer?

In the dry it is fine.

You need to be gentle in the wet ... 420Nm (on E10 .. more on PULP) at 2000rpm in the wet at the front wheels is ..... interesting to say the least.

If you tip it in with a bit of stick ... the torque vectoring is noticable as it will brake one wheel momentarily (nothing harsh) to pitch the weight to that outer front to get the most grip on it.

The 225/45R19 Bridgestones look a little undertyred for my liking ... but they do a decent job ... weird and expensive size .... I managed to get a screw in the corner tread block fairly new ... so had to get a new tyre.

Its a fairly comfy ride ... with a decent middle ground ... not overly hard or soft ... will definitely a feel a thud if you hit a harsh bump/pothole. But you can punt it around a nice piece of country road and have some fun. The way the engine/turbo is setup is for seamless flow of low-mid torque ... there is not top end in it ... it likes to upshift anyway before redline ... even in manual mode as well.

Its deceivingly quick around town .... not a racer though ... but I haven't really "flogged it" its not that sort of car really. You can manually shift with the "little" paddles while still in Auto (non-manual mode) ... if you decide you need a quick downshift or 2 or 3 to get your out of trouble ... and it will hold it for a short time ... but revert to Auto again if not further manual shift changes are noticed ... this I have found handy.

SPORT Mode feels weird and hangs onto gears too long .... for the way all the torque is low ... NORMAL is best for daily use.

I could go on ... my wife drives it more than I do though .... when I get a chance I take it out though.

[Mechan1k]

Originally Posted by kypez

Doubt it has enough power in NA form

One reason I stretched to the Turbo model.

N/A will be fine for non-enthusiast types.

[prydey]

Originally Posted by ToryMikey

So at work today I noticed Bendigo Nissan have a new ad out.

They were plugging the Navara relentlessly. “With up to 140 kilowatts of power!”

And all I could think of was the base Falcon ute (and sedan) eclipsed that thirty years ago. We haven’t just gone backwards since 2016. We’ve gone backwards since 1993.

How's the torque, payload and tow capacity of a base falcon ute?

Navara is nothing special as far as utes go but still has 450nn @1500rpm.

Let's not let the facts ruin a good story though.

[anobserver]

Originally Posted by prydey

How's the torque, payload and tow capacity of a base falcon ute?

Navara is nothing special as far as utes go but still has 450nn @1500rpm.

Let's not let the facts ruin a good story though.

I looked it up, and was shocked the Nissan falcon Ute was 30 years ago.

Edit: bring back the au Ute with a Chinese badge. Pricing to start at 45990 for the four cylinder base model.

[kypez]

Originally Posted by prydey

How's the torque, payload and tow capacity of a base falcon ute?



Navara is nothing special as far as utes go but still has 450nn @1500rpm.



Let's not let the facts ruin a good story though.

It's interesting when comparing torque numbers. Towing my XR8 up the hills near Sutton's Forest, the Everest and Ranger (3.2) loses speed on the climb. My G6E EcoLpi climbed them without losing any speed. 500Nm vs 409Nm. But much less weight of the car. 2280kgs total..

[DJM83]

Originally Posted by prydey

How's the torque, payload and tow capacity of a base falcon ute?

Navara is nothing special as far as utes go but still has 450nn @1500rpm.

Let's not let the facts ruin a good story though.

Too many are blinded by what we have 'lost'
They are 'gone' build a bridge and move on, stop living in the past. They are still there to buy if wanting to. And in many cases (Me included, bought imported Fords) never purchased a new falcon.
If i were looking at a base model ute in circa FG era, theres no way id have looked at a Navara/Ranger etc.

[prydey]

Originally Posted by kypez

It's interesting when comparing torque numbers. Towing my XR8 up the hills near Sutton's Forest, the Everest and Ranger (3.2) loses speed on the climb. My G6E EcoLpi climbed them without losing any speed. 500Nm vs 409Nm. But much less weight of the car. 2280kgs total..

I'd imagine that's more to do with the power though. If you came to a stop up the hill and then had to take off again, the Ranger /Everest should do it easier.

[kypez]

Originally Posted by prydey

I'd imagine that's more to do with the power though. If you came to a stop up the hill and then had to take off again, the Ranger /Everest should do it easier.

The Everest is 750kgs more than the G6E in EcoLpi trim. I don't think a measly 90Nm would be enough to make a difference. The G6E pulled hard. Always regretted selling it as it was much nicer to tow with than the Everest or Ranger. I bought into the hype of these dual cabs being able to tow effortlessly. They just don't.

Now they could go off road which was awesome but towing was weak.

[prydey]

Originally Posted by DJM83

Too many are blinded by what we have 'lost'
They are 'gone' build a bridge and move on, stop living in the past.

Agree.

We bought an Escape in 2021. 2L Ecoboost. Combined with the 8sp gearbox performance is every bit a match for FG falcon. Tech is light years ahead and it gets the family around fine. $36k d/a as well so even similarly priced to falcon in its run out days.

All you get from looking back is a sore neck.

[naddis01]

Originally Posted by kypez

I bought into the hype of these dual cabs being able to tow effortlessly. They just don't.

Now they could go off road which was awesome but towing was weak.

I took my Raptor to Herrods the other day. I towed my loaded trailer home with my family and assorted crap. Probably had a combined weight just under 5T. It was still better overtaking the roadtrains out here than my old 3.2 Ranger without a load. I have the best of both worlds now.

[kypez]

Originally Posted by naddis01

I took my Raptor to Herrods the other day. I towed my loaded trailer home with my family and assorted crap. Probably had a combined weight just under 5T. It was still better overtaking the roadtrains out here than my old 3.2 Ranger without a load. I have the best of both worlds now.

True. The new Raptor, I'd imagine, would make light work of loads. But that's not a 140 -180 kW thai special either.