Daytime Running Lamps

[OzJavelin]

I certain lighting conditions some cars cannot be seen at any reasonable distance, and on a 100km/h country road that can be very dangerous. From my personal observations:
1. TOO DARK; The most obvious is at dawn/dusk, however some people think it's OK for them to drive without lights because everyone else has their lights on and they can see the other cars OK ..
2. TOO BRIGHT; Driving INTO low lying sun in the morning or evening, or even in the middle of a sunny day, some cars driving on heavily treed roads cannot be seen in the shadows because of contrast with bright daylight.
I have an ex-Telstra car with daylight-running headlights and I'm actually annoyed my FG can't be setup the same way easily. I don't care if others get upset about it or think it's stupid .. at least they saw me. As for the DRL (LED-versions?) I personally think most look too try-hard, but anything that makes them seen is for the better.

[Smoke Pursuit]

Originally Posted by OzJavelin

I certain lighting conditions some cars cannot be seen at any reasonable distance, and on a 100km/h country road that can be very dangerous. From my personal observations:
1. TOO DARK; The most obvious is at dawn/dusk, however some people think it's OK for them to drive without lights because everyone else has their lights on and they can see the other cars OK ..
2. TOO BRIGHT; Driving INTO low lying sun in the morning or evening, or even in the middle of a sunny day, some cars driving on heavily treed roads cannot be seen in the shadows because of contrast with bright daylight.
I have an ex-Telstra car with daylight-running headlights and I'm actually annoyed my FG can't be setup the same way easily. I don't care if others get upset about it or think it's stupid .. at least they saw me. As for the DRL (LED-versions?) I personally think most look too try-hard, but anything that makes them seen is for the better.

FGs can be easily setup with daytime running lights.. Its just another plug / wire.

[aualright]

Originally Posted by flappist

Only in some situations. Other times it is bloody dangerous.

If you are travelling towards something that is bright like the setting or rising sun the the headlights actually diffuse the silhouette of oncoming vehicles making it VERY difficult to see them.

I have found the opposite to be true. The setting sun in your eyes sometimes makes oncoming vehicles hard to see (esp with a slightly dirty windscreen). When they have their parkers or headlights on they become more visible.

I live in a rural area and always have my parkers on when driving with the kids. Having said that, daytime running lights appear to be a bit of a toss but more importantly look ridiculous in imo. Parking lights are more than enough.

****

[KYSBF]

Originally Posted by psychoticgroove

It's a warning light.
'****3r inside'

+1

[Ben73]

At intersections people may have a quick look and see a vehicle, but due to not looking for long enough they may think it's parked or stopped. Some sort of lights is probably going to make them look twice.

[Keepleft]

Originally Posted by aualright

I have found the opposite to be true. The setting sun in your eyes sometimes makes oncoming vehicles hard to see (esp with a slightly dirty windscreen). When they have their parkers or headlights on they become more visible.

Not with parkers alone they don't. The power of 5watt parkers vs the sun?:-)

I live in a rural area and always have my parkers on when driving with the kids. Having said that, daytime running lights appear to be a bit of a toss but more importantly look ridiculous in imo. Parking lights are more than enough.
****

Park lights (sidelights/position lamps) @ 5watts are USELESS in order to "be seen" by approaching or forward traffic - if used alone when mobile; let alone in conditions of fog, rain, dust, gravel roads, bushfire smoke.

A DRL runs at 21watts and is a much 'better' option. Low-beam is the best option otherwise, as the DRL does not illuminate the taillights.

Personally, can live without DRL's - quite capable of switching on low-beam and or parkers and front fogs as needed. Its hardly difficult.

[aussie muscle]

My car is bright orange. if you can't see it coming you're too blind to be driving.

[nstg8a]

my only issue with me using the headlights during the day is that it dims all the controls on the dash, like climate control, stereo etc.

[bigsta]

If you have a dark coloured car you are a fool to not drive with lights on in any thing other than sunny weather.

Volvo invented the auto day running lights.

[Danny]

Originally Posted by geckoGT

DRL's are not fog lights and therefore they are not illegal in clear weather, end of story.

Fog lights are either white or yellow, aimed lower then low beam and have to be on a separate switch that operates only when park lights or the low beam is on.

DRL's are most often LED's with no reflector and are wired to turn on when the ignition is on, some turn off when low beam is on but some don't.

Batten down the hatches all you haters of them, they will become standard fitment to all new cars, I bet with in the next 10 years. There is way too much evidence in the effectiveness in crash reduction for them not to be.

To say people should not use low beam in daytime because they may hit high beam by accident is ridiculous. By that reasoning no lights should ever be used as an accidental activation of high beam can happen at any time and is in fact more of a problem at night than it is during the day. Lets just ban all lights and bump into each other, at least I won't get bored at work

Thankyou thankyou thankyou

Slash, how many of the idiotic haters of DRL's who throw them into the same bin as foggies drive old shizmobiles with dull low beams that look like candles in a vegemite glass? How safe is that?

Next time I drive past one of you fist shaking morons in the Golf R let me tell you something.

I CAN NOT TURN THE DRL's OFF...... They are on all day, every day, and no one can turn them off short of hooking the R to a VCDS Can Bus software and P around with the settings, and I would not be doing that in a 60k car just so you wayne kerrs will get off your high horses.

AUDI
MERC
HSV (even though how tacked on they look)
VW
RENAULT

All do these, they are NON reflected NON SWITCHABLE LED's and are there as a european design rule as stated many times.. They have as much use in fog as a FART in a blanket, but like a fart in a blanket, are great at ****ing you knobs off, because you have all conviced youselves that they are blinding and make your eyes water....

[geckoGT]

Originally Posted by Danny

Thankyou thankyou thankyou

Slash, how many of the idiotic haters of DRL's who throw them into the same bin as foggies drive old shizmobiles with dull low beams that look like candles in a vegemite glass? How safe is that?

Next time I drive past one of you fist shaking morons in the Golf R let me tell you something.

I CAN NOT TURN THE DRL's OFF...... They are on all day, every day, and no one can turn them off short of hooking the R to a VCDS Can Bus software and P around with the settings, and I would not be doing that in a 60k car just so you wayne kerrs will get off your high horses.

AUDI
MERC
HSV (even though how tacked on they look)
VW
RENAULT

All do these, they are NON reflected NON SWITCHABLE LED's and are there as a european design rule as stated many times.. They have as much use in fog as a FART in a blanket, but like a fart in a blanket, are great at ****ing you knobs off, because you have all conviced youselves that they are blinding and make your eyes water....

Think of it this way mate, while they are shaking there old fuddy duddy fists at your DRL's or headlights that are on in clear conditions, they have seen you and not likely to hit you (except out of road rage if they are really pathetic).

By the way, how is the Golf R? We are up to replace the Mini next year and I wanted to consider the Golf. Looks like I won't get any choice as the missus has her heart set on another Mini.

[mrbaxr6t]

I agree that running during the day with lights on makes you stand out as evidenced by the hatred toward people that drive around with lowbeam/foglights on people on this forum hate people that do that, if people that did it "blended in" then there wouldn't be the hatred toward people that do this on the forum...

I agree it is an easy at-a-glance method to know if a vehicle is moving or stationary. maybe when cars come fitted with these as standard because of the increased safety maybe THEN it will be acceptable to drive round with lowbeam/foglights on...

[Smoke Pursuit]

Originally Posted by aualright

I have found the opposite to be true. The setting sun in your eyes sometimes makes oncoming vehicles hard to see (esp with a slightly dirty windscreen). When they have their parkers or headlights on they become more visible.

I live in a rural area and always have my parkers on when driving with the kids. Having said that, daytime running lights appear to be a bit of a toss but more importantly look ridiculous in imo. Parking lights are more than enough.

****

Park lights are a waste of time. I can't even see mine on during the day unless im within 20 metres of the car.

Im looking for DRL LED's for my XR6 due to the roads I travel on, any ******** who flashes me with highbeam because I have them on can expect to get 530watts of light back in their face.. MORONS!!

[Trevor 57]

That will teach 'em!

[Danny]

Originally Posted by geckoGT

Think of it this way mate, while they are shaking there old fuddy duddy fists at your DRL's or headlights that are on in clear conditions, they have seen you and not likely to hit you (except out of road rage if they are really pathetic).

By the way, how is the Golf R? We are up to replace the Mini next year and I wanted to consider the Golf. Looks like I won't get any choice as the missus has her heart set on another Mini.

Hey mate, yeah the R is just great! Haven't got mine yet but the test drives blew me away, it's just beautiful, rides well, handles great (it's no crazy raw cooper s or 182 Clio, but it's fast and awd), and has a lot of kit!

I'd recommend one, although if the missus is set on a mini again then I don't think you'll convince her to go for the more sudued image of the golf!!!

[auxr]

Good points raised. I've got a great big red shiny car with a V8 and shiny wheels - guess what, I've almost been run into numerous times by people pulling out of side streets, merging on the freeway etc.

For some unknown reason drivers have not been able to see me.

I now always drive with low beam on - funny thing is, I don't seem to have any problem being seen now.

[Trevor 57]

Originally Posted by auxr

Good points raised. I've got a great big red shiny car with a V8 and shiny wheels - guess what, I've almost been run into numerous times by people pulling out of side streets, merging on the freeway etc.

For some unknown reason drivers have not been able to see me.

Funny thing that, they used to do it to me in a 26 metre long, 4.3 metre high, 62 tonne B-Double, so don't feel special -

[auxr]

Originally Posted by Big Trev

Funny thing that, they used to do it to me in a 26 metre long, 4.3 metre high, 62 tonne B-Double, so don't feel special -

- now that's something serious to contend with, you win.

[LTDHO]

Originally Posted by Big Trev

Funny thing that, they used to do it to me in a 26 metre long, 4.3 metre high, 62 tonne B-Double, so don't feel special -

Doesn't matter what ya drivin. Others don't look!

[Trevor 57]

Originally Posted by LTDHO

Doesn't matter what ya drivin. Others don't look!

Too true my friend, too true.

[geckoGT]

Originally Posted by Big Trev

Funny thing that, they used to do it to me in a 26 metre long, 4.3 metre high, 62 tonne B-Double, so don't feel special -

Now that is something you really should look out for because unless you happen to be driving an iron ore train, you will lose every time.

[Trevor 57]

and it is ugly when people loose, the last serious accident I had as a truck driver was about 1978-79 when a bloke did a U turn across double white lines straight in front of me, I hit him fair in the drivers door and sent him spinning towards a packed bus stop - was pretty ugly, he got a few scratches but totalled his car.

[BIGJB]

It is as simple as this. DRL's should be made manditory on all new cars. I do thousands of klms every year. You spot a set of DRL's
ages before you will ever see a car coming with no lights on.

[Silver Ghia]

A comprehensive report on DRL' s and compared to fog and headlamps, written back in 2003 is linked here:

http://plantaforest.mynrma.com.au/cp..._nrma_racv.pdf

There have been various abstracts from this report and other reports since with similar findings, including from Monash, but nothing seems to have been done yet in Australia to mandate them. Basically DRL's are more effective than low beam headlamps due to the type of light emitted and aiming direction (headlights are aimed toward the road), but are a good alternative if DRL's are not fitted. Fog lights should not be used during the daytime except in poor visibility (and that its illegal). Remember that DRLs should automatically switch on with ignition then off when headlights are switched on. Australia tends to lag behind when it comes to some safety items on cars. They certainly help on country two way roads.

[Keepleft]

NRMA and their related counterparts are referencing Paines research, and pretty much advocated simultaneously.


If, we mandate this, we'll also do the same for rear fog, triangle, vest, and I expect we'll see full UNECE wiring requirement, leading to front fogs only being operable whilst on the 'park' headlights position, the way Euro source regulations intended.
Domestic dumbing down, for local manufacturers, (who sit on deciding committee) has seen a market advantage for them, by not having to fit otherwise mandatory internationally required equipment.

[NeillNZ]

I fitted some nice Hella ones to my forward control van. I went to a lot of trouble to mount them according to the spec, which is min 600mm apart, and I forget now but I think something like min 300mm off the ground.

I see that some cars have them mounted very low. Mounting them too low is going to make them less affective on roads that are not completely flat.

I used to use my headlights on long trips and in fact there are now road signs up in some places (in NZ that is) that encourage you to use your headlamps during the day. Dedicated DRLs have a few benefits over headlamps:

1. Draw much less power like 5 watts instead of 110, so your battery charges faster, and I guess you could argue less fuel use, whatever.

2. They are designed to throw a long distance into the path of oncoming traffic, unlike low beam headlamps which light up only the road directly ahead of you.

3. They come on with the ignition so I don't need to remember to turn them on and even better I will never again get caught out leaving my headlamps on during the day as my van has no headlamp reminder.

4. They turn off when the the headlamps come on so there is no risk of blinding oncoming traffic at night time.

5. They have a very long life 50,000 to 100,000 hours. Headlamp bulbs have a much much shorter life.

They other day some guy coming the other way in a similar van made a gesture that suggested, well let's call it self gratification. I thought great, so you noticed me then, they must be working.

I think for me they were a wise investment.

[aualright]

Originally Posted by DASH GT

Park lights are a waste of time. I can't even see mine on during the day unless im within 20 metres of the car.

Mine are more than visible on the AU XR...despite the low wattage. Guess it has more to do with the position and halo of the light rather than the power of the bulb.

****

[TheSnowman]

Originally Posted by Smoke Pursuit

Americans were some of the first to introduce DRL's especially on motorbikes etc.

The studies that have been carried out show that the extra visability in the day can reduce the chances of having an accident. I happen to agree with this after travelling many 1,000's of kms on highways and rural roads certain coloured cars just blend in with the horizon, especially silvers and dark greys.

The safest rural cars to have are white or bright red but yes the DRL's can increase visability an extra km or so.

Americans first? not sure where you get your information from.

Effect of ambient light

The daytime running light was first mandated, and safety benefits first perceived, in Scandinavian countries where it is persistently dark during the winter season. As ambient light levels increase, the potential safety benefit decreases while the DRL intensity required for a safety improvement increases. The safety benefit produced by DRLs in relatively dark Nordic countries is roughly triple the benefit observed in relatively bright America.

Scandinavia

DRLs were first mandated in Scandinavian countries, where ambient light levels in the winter are generally low even during the day. Sweden was the first country to require widespread DRLs in 1977.

Source:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Daytime_running_lamp

[monk3y]

Originally Posted by Trevor 57

I agree, but that is NOT what Brazen said, he was talking about Telstra and daytime driving lights, which is another term for "white or yellow fog lights"

DRL's (Daytime Running Lights) are different to driving lights and fog lights.
DRL's come on with the switching on of the ignition - Legal in Victoria.
Driving lights are additional high beam lighting and can only be switched on/off with high beam on/off - also legal in Victoria
Fog lights are the white or yellow lights that you are referring to and can only be legally used in poor weather conditions.

[Trevor 57]

holy thread trawl - 2010, 6 years ago