What were the main reasons you jumped ship to a Holden ? - Page 3

prydey · 22-11-2013, 07:39 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by GTP534

Maybe not "due to" but there has been "since".

An entertaining thread but Adrenaline better not let the Enforcer see those 2 together!

most of the responses in this thread are answers to a question that wasn't asked.

Rodge · 22-11-2013, 08:09 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by grandpa_spec_F6

I sat in a VF SS Redline ute the other day, it reminded me why I don't like the seats in the F6. Man I wish I could get some GTP seats for it :(
.

Hi Mate, You have my sympathy. I thought exactly the same about my seats in my former F6, they are poor quality and that's what you get when seat production is outsourced from a reputable Australian company which made the BF2 seats to an Asian manufacturer. It doesn't matter how good the FH is, if the seats are the same as FG its an absolute deal breaker for me in terms of any update. Can a GT-P owner give you their VIN to order a set of GT-P seats or won't they fit ?

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mr Brooksy

I still find it incomprehensible that Ford won't offer 4 doors, 5 seats and rwd. There's just no way a family man with the Need for Speed can use a Mustang and put a few kids in the back for a 1000km holiday.
An M5 would be awesome! Still nice and big for the family, with serious grunt as well as tech that will satisfy my inner nerd. My only concern with it will be all the security stuff. I've heard some crazy stories of it being shut down remotely for no reasons at all. But I'm sure there are ways and means to disable this stuff.

You may recall i owned a Neo Blue BF2 Typhoon too mate and I absolutly loved it. I'd ride that horse as long as you possibly can if I were you.
The M5 really looks like a fantastic bit of kit but I have genuine concerns regarding reliability too, especially in regard to all the electronic stuff. The price is a fair whack too.

Quote:

Originally Posted by stevz

BMW's are hardly the pinnacle of reliability despite what some may think, and when things go wrong out of warranty you will need a bank loan for parts and repairs. Judging the reliability of the VF based on prior models is somewhat silly and narrow minded. If I apply the same logic it would mean that the FG is a poorly built, unreliable piece of crap because the EA was, or because the BA had quality issues.
VE's are maligned by many here yet mine and several others I know of haven't had as much as a blown globe. That's the problem with forums, you only hear the bad and not the good.

I agree regarding BMW's and that's my main reservation with them as well as shocking re-sale value of higer end models. That and high end models are a rip-off price down-under.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Express

My ship sails into all ports, I never limit my opportunities in life to anything including cars.

Holden is on my list of desirable cars because it offers a V8 at a reasonable value but it is nowhere near the top of that list. And like all cars regardless of the manufacturer, it has its pros and cons.

For me this thread would have been more interesting if it included all makes and was not just a fishing expedition for Holden lovers which will only rehash the same old comments thrown up in all the threads where Holden is mentioned.

There are members here that don’t currently drive a Ford and many more that own other models as a second car.

I’d be interested in knowing what Ford Forum members look for in a car in general compared to the many everyday moms and dads drivers who purchase the bulk of vehicles and whether Ford fills all their needs and why they buy other brands as a part of those needs.

Whether it’s because of price, equipment, lifestyle, family, reliability, performance, strength, AWD, safety, looks or whatever. Why did you choose something that wasn’t a Ford.

Do members also buy old school outside of the Ford badge?
.

Fair comment mate, I guess my focus was aimed at trying to get some feedback like Adrenaline's post below.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Adrenaline

Excellent quote.

I got a VF SS recently for a number reasons. I'd had a few FGs, in fact since '08 that's all I've really driven. Half a decade of the same, I was keen on something slightly different (although still high powered RWD large sedan- not many options under $100k). That's where Ford fell short. The FGIIs in showrooms at the moment are too similar to the original product launched back in '08. It's worsened by the fact that I've already had a few FGs, so it felt like I was buying the same car yet again. The revised FH model really should have been in showrooms already, six years is a long time between major updates and it's still a long way off (Oct 2014 they tell me). That's what lead me to look at the new VFs. In the back of my head I thought I'd still end up with an FGII G6ET or XR6T, but I swung by Holden and the VF blew me away. The interior really needs to be sat in to be appreciated. A lot of people were blown away by the photos of the interior when they came out, I wasn't, sure it looked pretty but I thought it looked busy. Different story once you sit in it. I cannot praise it enough, it's a very, very nice environment and the driving position is excellent for a tall bloke like me. I love the climate controls- twist knobs with a digital temp in the centre- so much easier than what I've been used to in FG. The materials are high quality, every knob has a nice rubberised feeling, almost everything is finished with a small splash of chrome- it looks the part. After walking into the Holden dealer with mixed thoughts, as soon as I sat in the SS I said to myself there's no way I'm getting another F series Falcon. The entire package is superior. The interior is leaps and bounds ahead, the technology is excellent. Stuff like blind zone alert is actually handy, so is front park sonar, rear park sonar also picks up gutters (something my FG struggled with) and visually pinpoints the obstacle on the reverse camera, the electronic handbrake is nifty, voice control for choosing songs, albums, playlists or controlling the phone saves a hassle on the move, remote start is handy in the morning to let the car warm up while climate control heats up the cabin, the auto park is a gimmick and doesn't work (not that I would trust it anyway, I only tried it out for ****s and giggles). The interior fit and finish is outstanding. I particularly like how the door handles and interior storage pockets are subtly illuminated at night, saves fumbling around. The steering wheel controls are also illuminated. All 4 windows are auto up/down (FGII still makes do with drivers window auto down only). The standard features go well beyond what Ford is offering with FGII. The seats are fabulous. Stock vs stock it's a much better handling car than the Falcon now. It also stops better. The electric steering actually isn't horrible, it's quite polished in fact, super light at low speeds to manoeuvre, really firm once you start tackling some corners. The car turns in much nicer than the Falcon (aluminium bonnet would help a bit, plus the shorter overhangs of the VE platform in general and the fact that the battery is in the boot). I looked at the SS, SSV and Redline. For me personally I thought the SSV lost points inside, it used satin silver highlights as opposed to piano black in the SS, its fake carbon fibre main dash spear was matte instead of gloss like the SS and wasn't as nice to my eye, I also couldn't option the SSV with the SS seats- you can only get the full leather as opposed to the leather (sportec) and suede combo that comes standard in the SS which I liked a lot (not a big fan of leather myself, too slippery and gets hot/cold). Redline was super nice but there's at least a 3 month wait. So I settled with the SS. It's got a few hundred kays on it now and I'm super impressed so far. I'm hoping Ford lifts their game with FH, I've never really wanted to buy a Holden but there was no way I was going to buy a Ford simply because it's a Ford. The VF was just too good.

Seems I've typed more than I intended to

But that's my story.

BINGO mate. The reason I started this thread is to get some good objective feedback like that. Many thanks for taking the time to so clearly articulate your reasons.

jamies · 22-11-2013, 08:48 AM

In my younger years I always wanted a Holden HJ, I searched and found a nice little V8 Kingswood, I lowered it super low and fitted widened 14 x 10 GTS wheels on it. The car looked tough as. I drove it around for a while and something did'nt feel right. In the end I sold it and went back to Ford.. That was my only indulgence into red lion territory. I admire some of the new HSV's but would I buy one no.
Some of us are Ford through and through and others are part time players, Every car I have owned has been a Ford except the HJ..

Heres a thought how can you support Ford in the V8 supercars and turn up to Bathurst in your SS commodore Pffffft as if....

WPR1 · 22-11-2013, 08:50 AM

Maybe this is a bit old school but I have had 2 commodores in the last 10 years but I never felt comfortable in myself having them. I come from a Ford family and it never felt right. I had 2 commodores after Ford stopped making the Falcon wagon a VT then a VY2.

What made matters worse I had a lot of trouble with both of them and going back into an FG Falcon felt like a massive positive step forward. The FG felt more powerful (I love the strong low down torque) and has a much better ride handling balance. After driving one the new ecoboost Falcons this engine has a similar feeling of very strong low down torque!

I also have had no issues with the FG (fingers crossed).

With the great reviews all the new Ford 'world cars' are receiving as they get released (Fiesta, Focus, Kuga etc) great handling, ride and gizmos I will be waiting for the full complement to be released before I update the FG.

I'm also a huge V8 Supercar fan and I just can't stomach the way Holden go about their racing so I will be staying true blue.

WPR1 · 22-11-2013, 08:52 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jamies

In my younger years I always wanted a Holden HJ, I searched and found a nice little V8 Kingswood, I lowered it super low and fitted widened 14 x 10 GTS wheels on it. The car looked tough as. I drove it around for a while and something did'nt feel right. In the end I sold it and went back to Ford.. That was my only indulgence into red lion territory. I admire some of the new HSV's but would I buy one no.
Some of us are Ford through and through and others are part time players, Every car I have owned has been a Ford except the HJ..

Heres a thought how can you support Ford in the V8 supercars and turn up to Bathurst in your SS commodore Pffffft as if....

Spot on, I feel exactly the same Jamies!

fordv8! · 22-11-2013, 08:57 AM

nothing could make me ever jump ship FORD to the core.

**PepeLePew** · 22-11-2013, 09:33 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by prydey

most of the responses in this thread are answers to a question that wasn't asked.

Totally agree, my point about Adrenaline was he put up a good case for the VF and no one shot him, no matter what his reasons. I think there has developed a mentality on the forum lately from the performance threads that anyone posting anything positive about the VF will get shot down, apparently this is not the case

I went through the same decision making process buying my GS, the VF SS Redline ute was my first port of call/quote. BUT...as you've said it'd be a very quiet thread if the responses were dependent on jumping ship due Fords announcement, actually it'd have one post being the original question

Rodge · 22-11-2013, 11:15 AM

^^ Except that if you re-read my original post I didn't actually articulate the question in the way some have inferred. The anouncement in May was merely meant as a reference point in time, (shorlty before that the VF came out), and the inviitation was there to comment if Ford's annpuncement was in fact one of the reasons or not.

BadMax · 22-11-2013, 11:52 AM

Great topic!

I'll preface my response: I had 4 Commodores in a row as the only logical company cars, there was no chance what so ever I was going to drive an AU-BF Falcon, in fact I passed up an AU and stuck with a Magna much to my bosses disgust!

But I did jump ship if you want to call it that and that was originally an FG XR6 Turbo sedan and I still pine for a turbo car again. But I thought what better introduction to the V8 world than a blown and injected daily, so the GS ute (tax reasons) got the nod. Load carrying isn't an issue as it's not used like that, the most it will see is either towing a Jet ski or two road bikes in a trailer and gear in the back.

Now, I've never been that happy with it even after it tuned to 364rwkw. It's still a very basic ute that is too expensive for what it is, virtually no technology in the cabin, chassis or NVH department.

Now my lease is up Easter time and I'm considering holding off selling it until, the FH is released. But lets be honest, it's not looking good for FPV for me. I really wanted an F6 ute, but they're long gone. The only reason for me to jump into an FH would be the fact it will be the last of the V8 Falcons not unless they release a ball tearer that is GT spec UTE, I'll probably shop elsewhere!

So now I find myself looking more and more at a VF, probably an SS-V with a Walkinshaw 375 kit. It looks OK, has plenty of gizmos, good brakes and let's face it, it isn't a slouch and I'm sure it wont try and punt me into the next lane at 100k like the horse cart sprung GS does.

I'm not one eyed, I don't call myself a FORD or HOLDEN man! I think that is just plain dumb. I buy what I like, I buy want suits ME, I don't buy what suited my dad or his dad or his dad before that.

WPR1 · 22-11-2013, 01:23 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BadMax

Great topic!

I'll preface my response: I had 4 Commodores in a row as the only logical company cars, there was no chance what so ever I was going to drive an AU-BF Falcon, in fact I passed up an AU and stuck with a Magna much to my bosses disgust!

But I did jump ship if you want to call it that and that was originally an FG XR6 Turbo sedan and I still pine for a turbo car again. But I thought what better introduction to the V8 world than a blown and injected daily, so the GS ute (tax reasons) got the nod. Load carrying isn't an issue as it's not used like that, the most it will see is either towing a Jet ski or two road bikes in a trailer and gear in the back.

Now, I've never been that happy with it even after it tuned to 364rwkw. It's still a very basic ute that is too expensive for what it is, virtually no technology in the cabin, chassis or NVH department.

Now my lease is up Easter time and I'm considering holding off selling it until, the FH is released. But lets be honest, it's not looking good for FPV for me. I really wanted an F6 ute, but they're long gone. The only reason for me to jump into an FH would be the fact it will be the last of the V8 Falcons not unless they release a ball tearer that is GT spec UTE, I'll probably shop elsewhere!

So now I find myself looking more and more at a VF, probably an SS-V with a Walkinshaw 375 kit. It looks OK, has plenty of gizmos, good brakes and let's face it, it isn't a slouch and I'm sure it wont try and punt me into the next lane at 100k like the horse cart sprung GS does.

I'm not one eyed, I don't call myself a FORD or HOLDEN man! I think that is just plain dumb. I buy what I like, I buy want suits ME, I don't buy what suited my dad or his dad or his dad before that.

As I have said I would call my family a Ford family but that is because on the whole we all like the product, it suits us and we think it is better than the other alternatives, not just because a previous generation has driven one.

I have had 2 Holdens (not an enjoyable experience to drive or own) 4 Toyota's, one Nissan, 2 Mazda's and one VW AND 3 Fords. Out of all these cars the Fords have had a better feel, just or more reliable and cheaper to run, so that is why I drive Fords now, though experience rather than history. In the end I like the feel of a car over how many gizmo's they have (as from previous experience the more gizmo's they have the more potential for something to go wrong).

So I have jumped away from Ford in the past but have also jumped back because in the end I just prefer them.

**PepeLePew** · 22-11-2013, 01:42 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Rodge

^^ Except that if you re-read my original post I didn't actually articulate the question in the way some have inferred. The anouncement in May was merely meant as a reference point in time, (shorlty before that the VF came out), and the inviitation was there to comment if Ford's annpuncement was in fact one of the reasons or not.

Thanks for clearing that up, seems I wasn't the only one confused by the first line in the post itself and the lack of that specific question on your list Rodge. And now that you mention it, my FG's seats are like mush, as a reference I actually found the Wildtraks leather pews more supportive I'd swap them tomorrow

DanielXR8 · 22-11-2013, 05:56 PM

I put my Territory in last year for some work on the front ball joints under warranty. Long story short the dealer stuffed up the job, scratched the car, claimed the cars suspension was mechanically A1 (it wasn’t) and made a bold face lie about the warranty on the work done. I made the decision then and there that this dealer was never getting a new car sale from me.

That left the Falcon at a disadvantage because my next nearest dealer was three hours away.

A few years ago I had reason to use Ford Customer Service and ask myself if only one of the three words in the title was accurate, would I want to risk having to have that experience again? So now my nearest dealer was off the list and I hadn’t seen anything in how Ford was treating new customers to make me believe they realized they had a big problem with their dealers and with supporting customers.

Sinead’s damage control approach to customer engagement on here, struck me as amateurish and very indicative of a culture at Ford Australia that just never learns a lesson. I was very unimpressed that after years of declining sales no one at Ford saw any reason to lift their game.

Still despite all of this, the Falcon was still in the running as I really like the supercharged engine in the GS/GT and consider the auto to be the best in class and I knew the opportunity to get a new one was not going to be around for that much longer. I had spent hours pouring over carsales listings and looking at everything I could online about FG.

Still in fairness I read up on the VF and decided to visit the local dealer. They had a couple of SS’s in and a Calais-V. Sitting in the VF was a revelation. It was so far ahead of the VE in quality and presentation as to be difficult to believe this was made by the same company. It was also technologically the most advanced car ever built in Australia. Holden had also adjusted the pricing to make it much better value, without you having to haggle with the dealer – something I don’t enjoy. Just sitting in the car, I was struck by how impressive a package Holden was offering in the VF.

I drove it and was impressed with the steer and the overall build quality, but found the 6 litre V8 very quiet and the auto while improved, no match for the ZF. Interior wise this car was a hands down winner over FG, but it still wasn’t enough to commit.

Dealer was patient and asked what I really liked and I said I was curious about the Redline. He asked about my colour preferences, features etc and said he would have one in a few days and would ring me when it got there. Well he did ring back and the car was the exact colour and transmission I was after (manual). Drove the car and absolutely loved it. While the engine is still too quiet, although interestingly a bit louder then the normal SS, the feature’s, technology and drive were absolutely fantastic in the Redline. For what you get it’s the best bargain in the Commodore stable in my opinion and just a great drive in its own right. I believe it to be the best well-rounded and complete performance bargain sedan in Australia at the moment.

So now I was left at looking at whether I loved the Supercharged GT enough that I wanted to pay the same or more for one, with less equipment, a generation behind in handling and refinement and a car that in FG form at least, never felt removed enough from a base XR6.

Took the car back and was asked if I wanted to go to an event at the dealer in a couple of days to meet with a Holden rep and get the inside story of the car.

Went home and talked to the wife. She knew I loved the Redline but was torn about not getting the supercharged GT I had been planning to get for a couple of years. She commented she liked the steering on the VF, found the clutch and general driving easy in the Commodore and thought it was a generation ahead and much better buy. Finally she hit me with a blunt statement. The Commodore would mean we didn’t have to deal with Ford again and all their issues. It was clear she didn’t want another Ford.

Deposit was down on the Commodore that afternoon. When I walked in the door, he had already put a hold on the car in the system for it not to be sold. I saw that on his screen and asked him about it. He told me he figured I would be back that week sometime to put the deposit down as clearly my wife and I were impressed with the car and since they were already aware that Redlines were being snapped up he didn't want me to have to wait months to get another. Smart salesman.

I think the VF isn’t as smart as the VE exterior wise, but as an overall package, Australians have never had it so good. The VF is a great swan song for the Commodore and when you drive it, you can tell the engineers and design team put more into this car, then a model upgrade suggests they should have. They were designing and building the last Australian Commodore and the VF shows they wanted it to end on a high note. As a company that is one thing I admire about Holden as a company. The large car market might be dieing, but they always put up a good fight. They've earned the respect of many GM execs because they don't give up easily and the VF optimises that. Its a dam good car by any measure and I believe all Australians should be proud that some of our fellow countryman were involved in making it happen.

Since owning it, I’ve really fallen in love with it and absolutely believe I made the right decision. Still as for Falcon. You know if Ford had lifted their game and fixed their dealers all these years ago like they should have, I suspect a Supercharged GT or XR8 would have been in the garage and treasured just as much as my signed print from Alan Moffat and the XC Cobra he won Bathurst in. The sale to us was Fords to lose and indeed they lost it.

The other day when I was out in the VF for a drive with my family, I looked at my wife and said. You know when they sack all those guys at Ford in 2016, they will be sacking the wrong ones. It will be the ones left after they are gone in the offices, that they really should have sacked.

Hope that answers your question Rodge.

duaned · 22-11-2013, 07:53 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DanielXR8

You know when they sack all those guys at Ford in 2016, they will be sacking the wrong ones. It will be the ones left after they are gone in the offices, that they really should have sacked.

So True! I reckon that is sig worthy!

Rodge · 22-11-2013, 07:59 PM

Daniel, that's brilliant !! You and Adrenaline have made extremly well articulated posts and that's exactly the feedback I was looking for, thanks.

I agree with you both, Ford simply havn't done enough. The techology in a FG2 is ostensibly just slightly modernised over a FG1 that came out five years and eight months ago. Ford have it all to lose, really the FH is at least a year to late and its become clear they simply can't match the technology in a VF. I agree with you Daniel, that like it or loathe it (the way Holden are playing the game), at least they're trying to stay in business.
The last FPV will be nothing more than a parts bin special, they have no meaningful money to spend and are effectivly just looking to extract as much money as they can from loyal enthusiasts.

When you look at the equipment and pricing of a VF SS-V Redilne its honestly enough to make you cry into your beer and ask how have Ford got so far behind ?

b0son · 22-11-2013, 08:35 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Rodge

When you look at the equipment and pricing of a VF SS-V Redilne its honestly enough to make you cry into your beer and ask how have Ford got so far behind ?

I wonder if they'll make anything more than a token effort to catch up with the
FH. Considering how half-arsed pretty much everything Falcon-related has been in the last year or so, I doubt it.

ZGM86 · 23-11-2013, 12:12 AM

I've only jumped ship once, to my old WB panelvan. I had always had Fords up until that point, and wanted a pano. There were no decent Fords around at the time (the only one being an ugly rough XE with XD grille & bonnet, white with grey primer and a ****** bonnet scoop and absolutely filthy and disgusting inside), and I've always liked old Holdens (ie: not Commodores).

The WB was nice looking - yellow with tinted windows, jellybean mags, a sunroof, 202 with extractors, and a reupholstered interior. It was also fun to drive. After a few months, I started getting a niggling feeling that something didn't quite feel right. I eventually realised that I missed driving a Ford every day. I put up with that though as it was still a good bus, that is until it started playing up.

During the last 2 months before I decided to sell it, something stuffed up on it every week. Clutch and gearbox problems, interior parts breaking off in my hands, and the straw that broke the camels back: it set fire to itself one day. It was an electrical fire under the bonnet that started when I was backing out of the driveway. I decided there and then to fix it then sell it. As cool as it was, I already had a project car to spend $$$ on (the ZG), and just needed something reliable as a daily. I picked up an EL XR6 and have been firmly back in the blue camp since!

V8 Ghia Mike · 23-11-2013, 01:56 AM

Daniel, you really should snail mail that post to every top Ford management person you can. While it won't make any difference to things now, at least it might make one or two of them think about their contribution to the downfall of FoA.

Indeed Rodge, it's intensely sad for me to comprehend how the mighty FoA has fallen also. I was reading an old 2004 Wheels magazine yesterday and looking at the sales stats for the BA. It had dropped 12%, down to 65,000 units, if I recall correctly.

Those figures today would surely see a tech-loaded FH. So sad.

Sorry for the derail.

Mike

prydey · 23-11-2013, 07:56 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Rodge

When you look at the equipment and pricing of a VF SS-V Redilne its honestly enough to make you cry into your beer and ask how have Ford got so far behind ?

maybe because Ford prefer to do things with their own money!!

GTJOHN · 23-11-2013, 08:00 AM

I have not and Will not Jump ship...Still Plenty of Quality Ford's in many variants
to keep me loyal. I have had fords for 25 Years, & have had Fords as Company Cars for last 10 years, never let me down...
UNless Holden stopped making those UGLY commode things and turned back time & release the HQ kingswood, id never go back to their products..besides if i had to jump ship, i would jump to Subaru, Toyota , Merc or Nissan long before i bought a GM product

H.G · 23-11-2013, 09:33 AM

Im thinking my next ute will be a rollerdore.. purely for the fact they arent a silly separate tub in the rear.. I think its ugly and only looks good with a tray back.. I love the front end of recent rollerdores. those front wheel flares are dead sexy.. and I also love the look of a real style side ute... no gaps between the cab and rear..
Also they retain some FORD look in that front end.. and I like that about commodore utes.

b0son · 23-11-2013, 12:14 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by prydey

maybe because Ford prefer to do things with their own money!!

Maybe GMH have that option because their HQ don't treat them with contempt?

GTP534 · 23-11-2013, 12:46 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by b0son

Maybe GMH have that option because their HQ don't treat them with contempt?

For the lack of a better expression, Ford are probably more "hard-nosed and business like." They didn't ask for any bailout during the GFC and that has to be admired.

There probably is also the "NIH" (not invented here) element in there as well but Mulally has managed the company well.

Bearman · 23-11-2013, 01:53 PM

This is a great thread all with sensible and well reasoned responses.

I'm very keen on a Ute next up and I'll find the SS very hard to go past. I've always thought the VE/VF Ute to be far better looking than the FG. The VF interior is something else again, the seats are so good it's almost like someone had my butt measurement when they designed the seats. Add the ready availability of a V8 and it all adds up to a package that is very hard to ignore.

Haven't driven any yet as it 'll be some time before I'll be doing anything but when the time comes I'll be wondering how I can justify a Ford given what else is on offer.

Rodge · 23-11-2013, 04:10 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by b0son

I wonder if they'll make anything more than a token effort to catch up with the
FH. Considering how half-arsed pretty much everything Falcon-related has been in the last year or so, I doubt it.

It is refreshing to see GM invest heavily into the VF and bring the vehicle up to a thoroughly modern level of current technology and you can see that tone reflected in some of the posts in this thread from those who have jumped ship.

Sadly Ford's bean counters have Ford Aust's engineers under a choker hold and with a very modest development budget so its hard to see how it will be anything more than what in the past would have been considered to be a mild facelift, AKA FG3.

strik9 · 23-11-2013, 05:28 PM

getting ready to jump ship.

went sat in an ss today to check out the new interior . it was very comfortable.
i,m waiting till start of next year for a gts. just enjoying the last few months in the f6. i was considering keeping it though............ but i need a bigger garage.

JG34JA · 23-11-2013, 05:43 PM

When we bought our Australian Ford it was brilliantly designed, well marketed, offered practicality in its platform and had found and opened a niche that today is one of the most popular in the market. In 2004 this was a revelation. Of course, I'm talking about Geoff Polites' Territory - a design that went head to head with the US designed Freestyle of the time and beat it for Australian production. 7 seats, AWD/RWD split, all the storage, functionality and most importantly optionality; it was one of those great bursts of inventiveness that Australians are regularly capable of. There was a very convincing case of the company investing the funds, developing a product with wide appeal, and releasing it to market as a variant of its current platform, and actually marketing it. I've always been proud of this effort as an owner.

How times have changed.

As for Holden, it is great to see them (product wise) going down fighting. One Holden I will jump ship to keep is my late Father's VY wagon, now with a leisurely 70,000kms on it, when my Mum will let me have it. But that is sentimental.

If I want a new Australian designed and made RWD station wagon (not SUV), the VF is the only choice! That they market it with V8 versions, manual versions, sports versions, luxury versions, everyday versions, LPG - well, one has to admire a company that actually markets their wagon range.

As a company, I've been far more impressed with the actions of Ford during and after the GFC, with the sole exception of how I think FOA has been treated.

Dr Smith · 24-11-2013, 03:06 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Rodge

Daniel, that's brilliant !! You and Adrenaline have made extremly well articulated posts and that's exactly the feedback I was looking for, thanks.

I agree with you both, Ford simply havn't done enough. The techology in a FG2 is ostensibly just slightly modernised over a FG1 that came out five years and eight months ago. Ford have it all to lose, really the FH is at least a year to late and its become clear they simply can't match the technology in a VF. I agree with you Daniel, that like it or loathe it (the way Holden are playing the game), at least they're trying to stay in business.
The last FPV will be nothing more than a parts bin special, they have no meaningful money to spend and are effectivly just looking to extract as much money as they can from loyal enthusiasts.

When you look at the equipment and pricing of a VF SS-V Redilne its honestly enough to make you cry into your beer and ask how have Ford got so far behind ?

I think I could do more with double the government grants, the issue is how did Holden get as much as Toyota and Ford combined when Toyota easily exports more cars then Holden ever has, and Ford has relied on more local suppliers in its recent history then its opposition. It's all moot now, won't we all be laughing (not!!!) if post 2016, the Aussie dollar drops to 75cents against the US and we make no cars here at all and all imports jump by the same currency fluctuation.

Rodge · 25-11-2013, 02:23 PM

I speculate Holden got more simply because they bleated louder, longer and more diligently than the other two.
Plenty of stat's to show every Country supports their manufacturing industry.
One company appears to be trying whereas another has all but given up, (actually has in terms of its performance devision). Sad state of affairs really. Anyway lets not turn this thread into yet another debate on Govt subsidies, I'm more interested in people actually answering the question of why they jumped to a VF, (some outstanding answers already, so if there's no more forthcoming that's fine as i think we have a pretty good handle on it already).

stace650 · 25-11-2013, 07:44 PM

I've owned about 20 cars, most of them Fords, but there have been three Holdens. All because the individual car was a bargain. An EJ Wagon for a grand, an HG wagon for $700 and a VL Turbo for 10 grand (when it was fairly new).

All were great cars excerpt for the first two. Yeah, the VL was a goodie - fast and fun. The others were horrible things. Wouldn't have another. And I don't like modern Holdens at all.

jimmyxr6t04 · 26-11-2013, 06:05 AM

I know i jumped ship to a Caprice 2 years ago, but having racked up 1000km on my SC GT i'm starting to see the light again haha... What the GT lacks in features, it sure makes up for it with that engine.

One thing i have thought about... If the SC GT pulls this hard, imagine how good the GTS would go!

Can't wait to put some more kms on the GT and give it a tune.