EDUCATION ! boasting proud dad.

[pottery beige]

Originally Posted by sudszy

Was the "select" school a government high school? they are the only ones that effectively reject students for not being smart enough at the junior levels. How has this thread turned into a private versus public schools debate?

One thing to consider is that there is a high correlation between how the child performs and the education of the parent and indeed the parent's attitude to education. Some students rise above the mediocrity of their parents looking for a better life, but that is the exception rather than the rule.

Not normally wishing to comment on matters of spelling on a forum such as this, but it is relevant to the context of the thread. I counted 9 spelling mistakes in your above piece, 3 of them repeated...indicating they weren't typos.

Hopefully not being too personal here, but if you really want your kid to get ahead, take on board increasing your own standards(especially in areas such as the ^ where really it would only take a minimum of effort) and that will flow on to your child.

the spelling police are on patrol.. and relevence to the topic is??... ffs.. fw......

[buggerlugs]

Great effort.........

[BadMax]

That's an awesome story, congratulations.
On the other hand some of the banter is getting a little silly.

In my opinion and I'm not a parent, but I believe it has more to do with the way you are raised and the attitude of the child. How many time do you see obese parents raising obese children or feral parents with feral children? It also extends to life and everything the child experiences within the family home.

I for example was educated from primary school to secondary school in the private sector. Unfortunately for me I was never an accademic and my re-enrolement to complete the last year of VCE was rejected as the school feared myself and a few others failing and their score dropping.

So I left, tried TAFE, didn't like it, got an apprenticeship, completed my time and a few years on the floor, started at the bottom again as a sales rep moving through a few others roles ending as a business development manager for a major global company and now the proud director of a successful business.
With the wrong attitude I would never have gotten to where I am in the relatively short period of time, I get strange looks from older folk when I tell them I own my own business at the age of 35.

[Lotte]

Originally Posted by z80

It's early days yet mate.

Ive done public schools,catholic schools, cheap private schools, multi age group extension programs, REAP programs, maths extensions, blah blah blah.

In the end I picked private schools....why?

To get away from people who didn't take the pains to bring their kids up with discipline, structure and morals.

A cheap private school is the worst option of all...especially the catholic ones..no funding...

I found the more you pay the better the education, all round education.

Your daughter will find she becomes bullied in a state school because she is too intelligent.

Public schools are all about "averages", they will want to average out your daughter because their teachers have to work harder to devise extension programs for her, they just won't do it.

You only get one chance with education...what you gonna do ?

Depends on the school. I went to a rural, state high school, and am currently studying engineering at RMIT, with fantastic marks. I didn't get bullied and not only was I one of the few intelligent people (it was a state technical college, making it even worse than the state academic schools for "smart kids to fit in properly"), i was a Girl Guide, played classical piano, and refused to be the norm. I might have gotten picked on once or twice, and kids HAVE changed (although, I'm starting to see them be more accepting than us adults), but to be honest, when you're proud of who you are, and know you can achieve great things, the few smart **** remarks are like water off a ducks, and eventually they stop. If they don't, if it's a good school, they'll deal with it, properly.
As for averaging, I read that she was in an advanced class, similar to the vertical learning program I had to endure (doing year 10 stuff in yr 9 etc), and the teachers most certainly DO NOT average it out, as when you get to VCE/HSC it's standardised across the state. I know heaps of people who flunked yr 12 at private schools due to the pressure, meanwhile, I got fantastic marks, because the emphasis was on being well rounded, not a complete brain and studying for more than 24 hours a day. (exaggerated, but its how some private school kids feel).
In addition, both my counsins went to a private all girls school, and one of them ended up transferring to a state high school, due to bullying issues, and that was over her being smart...

On a side note: Congrats to your daughter buddy, I used to be 3rd speaker for our debate team, and I know it's a damn hard position to be in!! Especially for a 10 minute prep topic!! As long as you make sure your daughter is proud of who she is, any kind of bullying that may occur, won't bother her, as long as it's not extreme. And it'll most likely dissipate with time if she ignores it. I remember when I got my Queen's Guide award, and few of the people in my year level and below caught wind and tried to give me curry over it. A week later I gave a speech about it at the all school assmebly, and it stopped. why? Because everyone realised there was no point trying to bring me down over something I was proud to achieve!!

Sorry for rambling lol, it's what I do best. I wish your daughter all the best, and good luck with the rest of her studies!

[gcg2503]

Originally Posted by sudszy

Was the "select" school a government high school? they are the only ones that effectively reject students for not being smart enough at the junior levels. How has this thread turned into a private versus public schools debate?

One thing to consider is that there is a high correlation between how the child performs and the education of the parent and indeed the parent's attitude to education. Some students rise above the mediocrity of their parents looking for a better life, but that is the exception rather than the rule.

Not normally wishing to comment on matters of spelling on a forum such as this, but it is relevant to the context of the thread. I counted 9 spelling mistakes in your above piece, 3 of them repeated...indicating they weren't typos.

Hopefully not being too personal here, but if you really want your kid to get ahead, take on board increasing your own standards(especially in areas such as the ^ where really it would only take a minimum of effort) and that will flow on to your child.

Fixed. Please refer below.

"Was the "select" school a government high school? They are the only ones that effectively reject students for not being smart enough at the junior levels. How has this thread turned into a private versus public schools debate?

One thing to consider is that there is a high correlation between how the child performs, (remove and) the education of the parent and indeed the parent's attitude to education. Some students rise above the mediocrity of their parents looking for a better life, but that is the exception rather than the rule.

Not normally wishing to comment on matters of spelling on a forum such as this, but it is relevant to the context of the thread. I counted 9 spelling mistakes in your above piece, 3 of them repeated...indicating they weren't typos.

Hopefully not being too personal here, but if you really want your kid to get ahead, take on board increasing your own standards (insert space here) (especially in areas such as the ^ where really it would only take a minimum of effort) and that will flow on to your child."

[gcg2503]

Originally Posted by sudszy

If anything your statement above is indicative of the fact that private schools attract better teachers, they don't let just any mug contribute to the writing of the external examinations.

The teachers that have a part in setting the exam are not supposed to be taking a yr 12 class in that subject. Also the exam is not set entirely by teachers but a panel also consisting of academics from universities etc.

You could argue that one of the examiners could pass on info to the other teachers at their school, possible, though doing so wouldn't be very professional at all and sooner later these people would be exposed and discredited and the school would then lose the cutos of having one of the examiners on their staff.

What's going to be on the exam is typically very well covered by "meet the examiners" sessions where any teacher can go along and hear what the examiners have to say about how the students went on the previous exam. This will give them the most idea of what is going to appear on the next one, sadly many teachers just cant be bothered finding out.

Marking papers is different, the marker can be a teacher at the yr 12 level. They are not given any of their own students papers to mark or indeed any from their own school. As students should only put a candidate number on their paper, they actually have no idea whose paper and from what school they are marking. There are also checks in place to see that the marks they give are consistent with what other markers are giving.

Fixed. Please refer below.

If anything your statement above is indicative of the fact that private schools attract better teachers, they don't let just any mug contribute to the writing of the external examinations.

The teachers that have a part in setting the exam are not supposed to be taking a yr 12 class in that subject. Also the exam is not set entirely by teachers but a panel also consisting of academics from universities etc.

You could argue that one of the examiners could pass on info to the other teachers at their school, possible (doesn't read well), though doing so wouldn't be very professional at all and sooner later these people would be exposed, (remove and) discredited and the school would then lose the cutos (you mean kudos....) of having one of the examiners on their staff.

What's going to be on the exam is typically very well covered by "meet the examiners" sessions where any teacher can go along and hear what the examiners have to say about how the students went on the previous exam. This will give them the most idea of what is going to appear on the next one, sadly many teachers just cant be bothered finding out.

Marking papers is different, the marker can be a teacher at the yr 12 level. They are not given any of their own students papers to mark or indeed any from their own school. As students should only put a candidate number on their paper, they actually have no idea whose paper and from what school they are marking. There are also checks in place to see that the marks they give are consistent with what other markers are giving.

[Lotte]

Originally Posted by z80

I completely agree with what you say and i know it to be true....first hand.


So....where do you send your kids...where they are more likely to pass or less likely to pass?

I'd send them to where they're more likely to pass, based on MERIT, not on the fact the teachers have had an upper hadn in creating they're exams.

And as for this second tier Uni stuff, the amount of RMIT (a second tier uni) engineering students overseas right now on their co-op placements, OR beign offered fulltime graduate employment from BMW, VW, Merc etc is quite high. Of my mates that applied overseas ~85% got placed at their first or second pref, and of those most have been offered work.

I've had plenty of debates with people from ANU (cousins go there), Melb or USyd, or other higher ranked unis, and you wanna know what argument comes outta their mouth when you have them in a corner and they know they're wrong? "Oh, you're froma second tier uni, what would you know". Can't even concede defeat. So, where would you rather send YOUR kids, somewhere they become pompous and stuck up because they have the money for their education, or somewhere they've had to work for their marks and knowledge and are therefore, in essence, more likely to succeed later on in life.

[gcg2503]

Dear Sudzy,

The OP wanted to reach out to fellow forum members and tell us of his little girls achievement.

Maybe his spelling has room for improvement. There is no need to belittle him by engaging in childish and immature behaviour pointing out all his spelling errors.

But given the fact that you chose to do so, please ensure that you check out your own posts for such issues.

Please do not take this personally.

GCG2503

PS: Cutos!

[sudszy]

Originally Posted by gcg2503

Dear Sudzy,

The OP wanted to reach out to fellow forum members and tell us of his little girls achievement.

Maybe his spelling has room for improvement. There is no need to belittle him by engaging in childish and immature behaviour pointing out all his spelling errors.

But given the fact that you chose to do so, please ensure that you check out your own posts for such issues.

Please do not take this personally.

GCG2503

PS: Cutos!

Appeared to be also a discussion on what is best for the child's education.
Do you dispute that the education and attitude of the parent is a factor?...let's hear some relevant comment on that rather than inflicting 'word perfect' spacing on my posts.

Whether Im the worst speller in the world or not is not the issue .

The OP can do better for his kid if takes on board something that is easily improved and would have most likely already been observed by even his daughter. By not seeking to improve on these things it sends all the wrong messages to the child.

Yeh, kudos, it was 3am.

[Chopped]

z80, I'm not sure if you noticed but all of the words you typed only reinforces the "private school snob parent" mindset that others are warning of.

I'm curious, would you employ someone based on the school they went to or their qualifications ?

I'm not attacking you personally , just an observation.

[GTP owner]

I don't care for the private/public debate in this thread. Instead I would say good on you for being a proud and happy dad, and for having a happy kid. Good parenting is more that the school they go to, the money you spend on them, or the fancy holidays they have. It's about doing the best for your kids and loving them every day, and loving the process of seeing them grow up and achieve what they are capable of.

[TZENU]

Originally Posted by GTP owner

I don't care for the private/public debate in this thread. Instead I would say good on you for being a proud and happy dad, and for having a happy kid. Good parenting is more that the school they go to, the money you spend on them, or the fancy holidays they have. It's about doing the best for your kids and loving them every day, and loving the process of seeing them grow up and achieve what they are capable of.

Someone actually understands the real reason for the thread.......

[z80]

Originally Posted by Chopped

z80, I'm not sure if you noticed but all of the words you typed only reinforces the "private school snob parent" mindset that others are warning of..

I notice everything, especially oxygen thieves.

The interpretations people put on the literal word on forums can be wide and varied.

Can't say it bothers me....its fantasy land in cyberspace.

Shrug the shoulders and move on.

Originally Posted by Chopped

I'm curious, would you employ someone based on the school they went to or their qualifications ?.

I only employ those people who make me a profit.

I run an IT company, I first eliminate by the following criteria, regardless of qualifications....

(a) by the extent of the body art
(b) by the extent of the body piercings
(c) by whether they have enlarged pupils
(d) by whether they smoke or not...(it's a personal hygiene issue these days)

Any of those are a show stopper.... I cannot present a person with any of those traits to a customer.

Statistically a person who has a private school history tends to get further in the interview process before we ask for an academic background.
My opinion is that private schools force more discipline on kids.
They don't allow "freedom of expression" by mutilating your body.

That's been our experience, whether the readers of this thread like the blunt truth or not.

I then move to an interview if those simple hurdles are met.

Originally Posted by Chopped

I'm not attacking you personally , just an observation.

I appreciate that, the written word can be blunt when succinct.

(plenty guilty of that, including me)

BTW...I went to the poorest public schools in Victoria....so have a bit of an idea about public schools

[Work Horse]

Originally Posted by z80

BTW...I went to the poorest public schools in Victoria....so have a bit of an idea about public schools

Do we know each other!??

Interestingly, in spit of my education, I run a small business that employs staff also.

May be it's not about the school you went to?

May be it's about the person you are?

Naar, what am I talking about!??

gtfpv, love and support your daughter as you clearly do.
Let her make up her own mind about the public V private debate. She is clearly smart enough to do so, and may suprise you one day...

[gtfpv]

WOW !! i'm impressed with the replies and differing opinions this thread has sparked . and let me say i RESPECT , everyones point of view here . I cannot comment on others lives and experiences , only my own , and my own differs from many of yours , and yours are equally as valuable as mine . so thanks , and i appreciate reading your posts and actually am very interested .
those of you who see my grammar ERRORS , i could type better , but i cant , i could use spell check, but i could'nt be bothered , it would only show an untrue representation of something i'm not anyways . i have no interest in grammar, i often ask my children how to spell certain words , or my wife , they're all better spellers . now i'm not at all worried about that , its not how i make a living , and i'd rather be a person who can change a tyre ,solve engineering problems, redesign or improve machinery, manufacture tooling , learn what makes an aircraft stay in the air , and what failsafe means , than be doctor who can spell, and do surgury , but none of the above . OK.
the school my child got rejected from was a PUBLIC SELECT school .

many of you might be confusing demographics rather than private /versus public , education, as that plays a greater role .
what do i deem as success ? it doesnt matter , but how about i give you some ideas , A phylisophical person/ verses someone who doesnt think of others. rich versus poor, happy versus sad,a sense of acheivement versus working everyday through your life, free versus busy , see all of the world, versus buy houses and invest. ITS A MIXED BAG AND ONLY YOU CAN DECIDE !!! many other examples of course .

IT didnt take me long to see with my eyes and form my own opinions on what life is like , i was about 17 , i'm 42 and still forming opinions now . but when i left school, the 2 dumbest people who got very picked on at school , and both could not read nor write , got highly paid jobs , one straight onto a building site earning around $800 a week , i was on $150 as an apprentice , my friend who was always in the top 5% done an arts degree and could not get a job, for years and years , he is now a clerk in an office , this other dumb dude , started with a garbage truck company , bought an investment house , and bought the garbage truck company some years later .
i left school in year 10 public, and was only good at maths , did an apprenticeship , finished it , was a national nominee for apprentice of the year nominated from tafe, 1st in stage 3, with distinction , and then a few post trades , of which i excelled in all of them . thats it for me , but the spelling , not so great .
many people who went to better private schools than i ,got pregnant became housewives and never worked , some blokes worked in a bank untill they decided they couldnt afford to move out , so ended up as jail security guard shift workers , and some became police . none of them excelled at anything or became successfull in employment .
back then i'm not sure private schools were popular . today though , i have noticed people panic by the thought that thier kids must attend a private school otherwise they are doing the wrong thing by the child and letting them down , whilst telling stories about how bad the attitude at public schools are and how bad the students and all the public schools are, with some pride that they are sending thiers to the private school . only to notice the older kids that have left are working at the pub , kfc , mcdonalds , with thier dads business , joining the army , doing a plumbers apprenticeship etc etc , none of them accept one is studying at uni to become a NURSE , And she went to a private school.
now IMHO in the eastern suburbs , there is businesses , and there is money , and children go to public and private schools , moreso private schools , when they come out of school , they start in the parents business as a junior executive , or they start with an associates business with a high paying job , and may go to uni also , i dont relate that to which school they went to , sorry .
i hope i have put my point of view across , and i'm sorry about the punctuation, and spelling .

back on topic , my daughter got 1st in science , and 1st in music , 4th in maths , and top 10% in all other subjects in her 1st high school report , with an overall outstanding report comment in all areas .
we then received a letter of acheivement from her school praising her for her debating skills , and telling us we should be proud of her with her level of debating skill , and wishing she persues it further . i'm starting to feel she will choose her own way .
my son has been approched by a tennis club , having came 1st position under 15s comp tennis at age 10 , and asked what his intentions are , they have suggested daily coaching and perhaps leaving school at age 12-14 to pursue tennis !!!. i dont know about that one , but i think he is presenting an award off his primary public school , to me today , his principle has acknowledged him for a surprise award , MATHLETICS I THINK . i'll find out today .

[NickyN]

Originally Posted by gtfpv

WOW !! i'm impressed with the replies and differing opinions this thread has sparked . and let me say i RESPECT , everyones point of view here . I cannot comment on others lives and experiences , only my own , and my own differs from many of yours , and yours are equally as valuable as mine . so thanks , and i appreciate reading your posts and actually am very interested .
back on topic , my daughter got 1st in science , and 1st in music , 4th in maths , and top 10% in all other subjects in her 1st high school report , with an overall outstanding report comment in all areas .
we then received a letter of acheivement from her school praising her for her debating skills , and telling us we should be proud of her with her level of debating skill , and wishing she persues it further . i'm starting to feel she will choose her own way .
my son has been approched by a tennis club , having came 1st position under 15s comp tennis at age 10 , and asked what his intentions are , they have suggested daily coaching and perhaps leaving school at age 12-14 to pursue tennis !!!. i dont know about that one , but i think he is presenting an award off his primary public school , to me today , his principle has acknowledged him for a surprise award , MATHLETICS I THINK . i'll find out today .

Well said! Or rather, well written! I wanted to post something about offering opinions and comments and see you just did. I agree with you, the bottom line is respect for others. Everyone comes from different lives, experiences, families, education, jobs,.... the list is endless.

Yes, your daughter will probably choose her own way or she'll debate with you on why and offer solid evidence to back her pov and decision. Which is a good thing right? And your son at age 10 must be an ace on the courts! But idk about leaving school at 12-14, that's really young. Private tutoring for him might be the way to go if he is seriously into his sport. You have successful and talented kids, congrats to you! It's probably just the beginning for them!

[irish2]

Just to put this out there. I went to one of the poorest public schools in probably the whole of Australia. Many students were going nowhere in life except for the dole que. Some however are now millionaires playing football. Two girls from my grade now hold PHD's in science.

When I went to university I became friends with two guys from Brisbane Boys Grammer who were doing the same course as me. I beat them in almost every subject. The difference is my parents saved $18k per year in fees. Education is what you make of it.

[Franco Cozzo]

If you want the best for your kids if you can afford it send them to a private school. I went to a public school, we where constantly having issues with not having proper equipment in trade subjects or it was very old, warn down and broken.

Parts of the school flooded badly when it rained, windows wouldn't open or close, etc.

But its up to your daughter if she wants to learn or do something with herself, that could change later on down the track. No point in sending your kids to a private school if they just play around and disrupt everyone else.

I know when I got into Year 12, I couldn't be bothered doing anything and rather went to school to see friends, rather than learn.

[Ford_The_Win]

Originally Posted by irish2

Just to put this out there. I went to one of the poorest public schools in probably the whole of Australia. Many students were going nowhere in life except for the dole que. Some however are now millionaires playing football. Two girls from my grade now hold PHD's in science.

When I went to university I became friends with two guys from Brisbane Boys Grammer who were doing the same course as me. I beat them in almost every subject. The difference is my parents saved $18k per year in fees. Education is what you make of it.

Total agreeance with this. Ultimately it comes down to the child. Both public and private have their downsides. I went to both and to be honest I preferred the public system. Yes private schools have better computers and new desks but there was an air of entitlement about private education that I loathed when at school. Catholic/religious schools waste way too much time on spirituality and religious education, although if you're religious you wouldn't see it as a waste of time I suppose. Also I think when kids go through the public system they develop better social skills and are more street smart because they are with other kids from all sorts of backgrounds and classes. Drug and alcohol use is just as, if not more prevalent in the private system because rich kids can afford to buy them. Look at all of the drama associated with Xavier College over the past few years - cocaine use, bullying, not exactly the ideal environment for children to be educated in.

[gtfpv]

woohooo . daughter just came home today and announced she came 1st in maths , 1st in science , 1st in english, and 1st in music , is receiving an award tonight at a school presentation for making a short movie on the computer , and has made DUX of year 7 . .
and my boy was asked to apply for state ambassodor for world education as he came in top 20 of state in year 5 . if he gets the state position he gets media rights to represent nsw education . we actually said no to that , as we think it might be a little too much on a year 5 student . but he has been nominated for school captain and finds out on friday . not that i'm baosting .

[gcg2503]

Well done!

Make sure they get some nice Christmas presents OK

[SEZ213]

You certainly have two very talented children mate, which is as much a reflection on you as it is on them. You should be proud of yourself and so should they. Congratulations and I hope there are many more rewards to come for them both (and you as proud dad)!

[FG_Frodza]

Well done, glad she made you proud and nice to see a parent who cares about their kids! Her success really is a reflection on you as a prent as I doubt that she would go very far without great support from her parents

To those going on about public vs private schools: please start another thread about public vs private schools if you want to talk about that. I would like to share some views but I am not prepared to hijack what should be a nice thread.

[gtfpv]

Punctuation and spelling !!!! they didn't get that from me . LOL .

[mondo_broady]

to the OP, that's pretty cool. my daughter has just finished yr12 at a selective high school and i know first hand how proud they are of their achievements in things like debating, so to have a win against one is quite a thing for her to be proud of.

to those in here debating private v public education, you should apologise for hijacking the thread and turning it into a slanging match...

[AU Mont]

Originally Posted by TZENU

Someone actually understands the real reason for the thread.......

Did you expect it to be yet another ego inflating thread that commonly pops up on these forums with no other conversation than "thats great !!"

a healthy debate about private vs public schools was very called for imo. The op had hinted a number of times about which he thought would be the best for his child

[trippytaka]

Nice to hear! All too often these days education isn't given enough importance.

[Iggypoppin']

Z80, no offence mate but you haven't got a clue what you're on about. Congratulations gtfpv, you sound like your daughter is a very talented young girl.

[dave351cid]

a good news story. great to hear about kids doing well.

[mondo_broady]

Originally Posted by AU Mont

a healthy debate about private vs public schools was very called for imo. The op had hinted a number of times about which he thought would be the best for his child

reminds me of this....



imho the OP wanted to boast about his daughter's achievements. the other stuff was just background info...

anyway, back on topic.