Suggestions for FGII Wagon Designs.

OffRoadFalcon · 07-11-2011, 06:50 PM

G'day everybody,

I draw cars. And I am a big Falcon wagon fan (maybe because my family has owned a AUII Futura wagon for 9 years?). I, like many, was sad to see that Ford Australia wasn't planning to continue making the the Falcon wagon.

So, using my drawing skills, I've been planning to draw a FG Falcon wagon. No, not a sports wagon like Holden's Commodore. A full size, proper, wagon. it will be a big wagon, but I intend to design it to both look really good, but still have a very large amount of room inside for whatever anybody throws at it. I intend for it to be larger than the previous wagons, both inside and out, but not so much bigger than it is a pain. It won't turn out to look like the awful wagons Holden produced before the Sportwagon. It will be long, sleek, and stylish (if I don't muck it up).

Due to me being extremely busy this year with school and other activities and events, I haven't had time to get started on this project. And now with the FGII coming soon, I've decided that my wagon designs will also be FGII. I'm going to draw all the available sedan models, in wagon form. XT, G6, G6E, G6ET, and of course the XR models, as well as an AWD wagon, for those who don't need a big 4wd, but would like a little more capability. I'll also try to revive to type of factory bullbars that were available for the AU models. The bar will be intergrated into the bumper in the same sort of way. I'll also draw fully optioned models (some options will be my own ideas).

Why have I got this thread? Well, I want to know what you think would be good. Design suggestions (such as roofs), options (weather sheilds, roo bars, nudge bars, roof racks), anything, for any of the models. I will keep the basic front end styling the same as the FGII Falcon sedans, but the rear will be quite different.

Also, any pictures of the FGII Falcons would be helpful. Wheels, the front, anything really. Just so I can get it looking as accurate as possible.
I think that's all I wanted to say...
Hopefully you guys have some awesome suggestions for me to think about.

Thanks

- Christopher

mik · 07-11-2011, 07:21 PM

i always thought the last wagons where a pretty good shape , just under optioned and well.... a bit plain, maybe some chrome to break up that big body, a sporty looking roof rack, some flash looking tail lights that go right across the tailgate? not that the oldies where bad , but they went for years, there`s my 2 bob

, i look forward to your revised wagon.

OffRoadFalcon · 07-11-2011, 07:27 PM

Chrome would be nice... I'll design a few different roof racks... Hmm, not sure about the taillight idea, never really liked that type of lights before, but I'll see. First designs will looking toward the front and side. Next will be the rear and side. The olde lights weren't bad, but something else is in order, something fresh.
Thanks

Chris_Rogers01 · 07-11-2011, 08:00 PM

i like the Holden Sports wagon idea with the short range needed to open the boot but if there was a extra rear seat option i reckon that would influence sales? since 4wd are very expensive

Road_Warrior · 07-11-2011, 08:26 PM

Go the full size wagon. Like I said to you in the other thread, try implementing a floating roof style from the Liberty with your FG wagon and see how it goes. A pic for reference:

IMO that is one of the most stylish wagons of recent times and some of the design features of its roof and waistline and glasshouse would look great on an FG wagon.

OffRoadFalcon · 07-11-2011, 08:36 PM

Great suggestions guys. Yeah I'll definitely have a go at that idea Road Warrior. I'll find some other pics as well, I don't usually draw side on anymore, but I may for this project...

Thanks guys

Bossxr8 · 07-11-2011, 09:22 PM

Try using the Territorys rear window and black d pillar design, and stretch it to suit the bigger size of a Falcon wagon.

OffRoadFalcon · 07-11-2011, 10:40 PM

keep the suggestions coming guys!

jpd80 · 07-11-2011, 10:48 PM

I heard that the long wheelbase cars were conditional on both surviving as FG variants
of Fairlane and Station wagon were to use longer wheelbase and the longer rear doors
but when Fairlane was cancelled, the chances of FG wagon really nose dived as the cost
for doing the doors and rear quarter panels couldn't be properly amortized without the
more expensive Fairlane to spread the costs.

**Gothefalcon** · 08-11-2011, 12:04 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jpd80

I heard that the long wheelbase cars were conditional on both surviving as FG variants
of Fairlane and Station wagon were to use longer wheelbase and the longer rear doors
but when Fairlane was cancelled, the chances of FG wagon really nose dived as the cost
for doing the doors and rear quarter panels couldn't be properly amortized without the
more expensive Fairlane to spread the costs.

Yeah... that's what they say... but why doesn't that apply to Sedan or Ute or Terry then?? There are some parts shared between all 3... but there are HEAPS of parts only used on each individual one ! If they made a good enough Wagon... it would pay for itself... plus.. with any "all new" Wagon design... the back end stays pretty much the same for the next 9 - 10 years ! That's plenty of vehicles to recoup tooling costs from !

Anyway... This isn't about that.... it's about having a go at designing a decent FG based Wagon... just for the fun of it !

Great to see... and good luck Chris!

Pepscobra · 08-11-2011, 12:08 AM

I love the look of the Territory... If you could somehow get those proportions onto a Falcon wagon, it would be great... But then you need to ask yourself, why does Ford need a Falcon wagon when it has the Territory?
Effectively, it is the Falcon wagon, right?

Brazen · 08-11-2011, 12:09 AM

something like a VW Passat, classy but still with a proper cargo rear end.

**Gothefalcon** · 08-11-2011, 12:37 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Pepscobra

I love the look of the Territory... If you could somehow get those proportions onto a Falcon wagon, it would be great... But then you need to ask yourself, why does Ford need a Falcon wagon when it has the Territory?
Effectively, it is the Falcon wagon, right?

No way !! Ha ha!! I've gone to great lengths to build a BF2 AWD Wagon... just to keep all the benefits the Wagon has over the Terry ! It has a much bigger boot (seats up or down) & better load capacity.... it's lighter (even with AWD)... it's lower.. so I can still load the roof racks standing on the ground.. & I can fit LPG to it... have the spare in the boot & still have more room in there than a Terry, without !

I like the Terry... but it's an SUV... it's not a proper Wagon! (My biased opinion, I know!

)

**Gothefalcon** · 08-11-2011, 12:41 AM

Here's a challenge for you Chris... why do the rear doors have to be different to sedan?? You could try an option that utilizes the sedans doors.. and still looks good !!?? won't be easy to get the rear glass line right... but if you get it right... Ford would have less excuses for not making one !

prydey · 08-11-2011, 07:29 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Gothefalcon

... Ford would have less excuses for not making one !

i wasn't aware ford had to justify their decision to a handful of people on an enthusiast forum that wouldn't buy one new anyway.

good luck with the drawing chris.

madwag · 08-11-2011, 08:33 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Road_Warrior

Go the full size wagon. Like I said to you in the other thread, try implementing a floating roof style from the Liberty with your FG wagon and see how it goes. A pic for reference:

image

IMO that is one of the most stylish wagons of recent times and some of the design features of its roof and waistline and glasshouse would look great on an FG wagon.

...+1

madwag · 08-11-2011, 08:42 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by mik

i always thought the last wagons where a pretty good shape , just under optioned and well.... a bit plain, maybe some chrome to break up that big body, a sporty looking roof rack, some flash looking tail lights that go right across the tailgate? not that the oldies where bad , but they went for years, there`s my 2 bob

, i look forward to your revised wagon.

Yep chrome, and tail lights like my old verada that go right across!
and a bumper bar you can sit on!
and mount the rear wiper in the glass.

**Gothefalcon** · 08-11-2011, 09:24 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by prydey

i wasn't aware ford had to justify their decision to a handful of people on an enthusiast forum that wouldn't buy one new anyway

Wouldn't be the first time a company like Ford responded to a customer request... especially if they thought they could make a quid or two out of it !
This is where the coupe-utility idea was born out of.... (A customer request... not AFF)

I've owned 6 Falcon Wagons over the years... got a few years left in me yet, so I will need to update a few more times before I'm done...

I might be only one voice... but I'm sure there would be enough others... if ford were to build it right !

A fella can live in hope, right??? Nothing wrong with that !

prydey · 08-11-2011, 09:30 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by mik

i always thought the last wagons where a pretty good shape ,

drop the ride height, bit of colour coding and tint and some tasteful rims

its sitting down a bit more in the bum 'cause its choc full of luggage.

i never had a problem with the old shape.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Gothefalcon

A fella can live in hope, right??? Nothing wrong with that !

absolutely. i'm not against the wagon, but i can't afford to buy new, so i'm not going to bleat on here about ford's decisions. thats just the way i look at it.

Till_Lind · 08-11-2011, 09:37 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by prydey

drop the ride height, bit of colour coding and tint and some tasteful rims
image

its sitting down a bit more in the bum 'cause its choc full of luggage.

i never had a problem with the old shape.

absolutely. i'm not against the wagon, but i can't afford to buy new, so i'm not going to bleat on here about ford's decisions. thats just the way i look at it.

I always felt the rear window hindered AU/BA wagons looking good, but that wagon there looks pretty damn good.

Brazen · 08-11-2011, 09:45 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jpd80

I heard that the long wheelbase cars were conditional on both surviving as FG variants
of Fairlane and Station wagon were to use longer wheelbase and the longer rear doors
but when Fairlane was cancelled, the chances of FG wagon really nose dived as the cost
for doing the doors and rear quarter panels couldn't be properly amortized without the
more expensive Fairlane to spread the costs.

That would have been the case with EA to BF where a fully pressed door panel was used -meaning different doors for sedan and wagon. FG is different it uses a pressed lower with a upper window frame attached. All that needs to be changed is the window frame - no new door pressings are needed for FG wagon.

FG looks like it has been future proofed as a wagon:

The way the rear doors come out straight even though the rear tapers in might look slightly awkward on the sedan but it means a wagon body can flow out straight.

The way the window line levels out might make the sedan look less dynamic but it means the window line on the wagon can continue.

Should be interesting to see some ideas.

KITBAG · 08-11-2011, 09:53 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by prydey

drop the ride height

How is this.........

prydey · 08-11-2011, 10:04 AM

chris - for practicality (none of this form over function stuff) i would suggest steering away from the sloping roofline of sportwagon/liberty type wagons and keep the large rear opening of the previous falcon wagon. i fitted a 8kg washing machine in the back of mine. wouldn't have a hope of fitting in a sportwagon, and probably pushing it in a territory even.

also keep the reasonable rear overhang. keep reasonable length to the storage area. afterall, that is what a wagon is all about.

i would guess that many sportwagons are sold simply because its a different body style, not because its a wagon. IF (and thats a big if) Ford were to consider the wagon at a later stage, it would be suicide to go down the same path as holden. need to keep it a REAL wagon.

Mr Hardware · 08-11-2011, 10:09 AM

It Seems A Wagon That Is Practical And A Wagon That Sells Are Mutually Exclusive

OffRoadFalcon · 08-11-2011, 11:22 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by gothefalcon

Yeah... that's what theysay... but why doesn't that apply to Sedan or Ute or Terry then?? There aresome parts shared between all 3... but there are HEAPS of parts only used oneach individual one ! If they made a good enough Wagon... it would pay foritself... plus.. with any "all new" Wagon design... the back endstays pretty much the same for the next 9 - 10 years ! That's plenty ofvehicles to recoup tooling costs from !

Anyway... This isn't about that.... it's about having a go at designing adecent FG based Wagon... just for the fun of it !

Quote:

Originally Posted by gothefalcon

Great tosee... and good luck Chris!

Thanks mate. My designed wagons will be longer than the sedans, so obviouslylike the older wagons have a longer wheelbase. But if Ford decided they wantedto build the wagon, they don’t necessarily have to do everything exactly thesame way as in my design.

Quote:

Originally Posted by pepscobra

I love the look of the Territory... If you could somehow getthose proportions onto a Falcon wagon, it would be great... But then you needto ask yourself, why does Ford need a Falcon wagon when it has the Territory?
Effectively, it is the Falcon wagon, right?

I think I’ll leave the Terry proportions tothe Terry. If I try to use them I reckon my wagon will end up looking like oneof the previous Holden wagons. I don’t like that bloated looking back end. Oneidea I’ll try will be to use a similar design to the previous wagons, which Ithink was an excellent design, and freshen it up for FGII. But it won’t be soobvious that people will just say “They took the rear end straight from a Bseries”. The overall shape will be similar. Of course the floating roof styleis another I’ll try.

Ford probably often reckon that it iseffectively a Falcon wagon. But it isn’t. Not as much space, as Gothefalconpointed out. If my Dad had to get a newcar (if something happened to our AUII Futura wagon) then he wouldn’t get aTerritory, or a Mondeo wagon. He’s a landscape photographer, and the businessis still small, so we do most of the work for now. He has to carry up to 2.6mlong pictures in the wagon. We also have a big portable display for shoppingcentres and other venues. 12 big doors, 12 legs to stand them up, 4 foldedtables, 3 bags tools and hanging equip, stool, some other things, and all thatfits into the wagon at once. JUST. No space left by the time we’re finishedpacking. The two front seats are left empty. If he had to get a new car, it’dhave to be another Falcon, or something bigger.

Quote:

Originally Posted by gothefalcon

Here's a challenge foryou Chris... why do the rear doors have to be different to sedan?? You couldtry an option that utilizes the sedans doors.. and still looks good !!?? won'tbe easy to get the rear glass line right... but if you get it right... Ford wouldhave less excuses for not making one !

Interesting idea, might give it a go. Seeif it looks ok. I’m imagining what that might look like. I reckon it couldwork. No harm in trying it anyway.

Quote:

Originally Posted by madwag

Yep chrome, and tail lightslike my old verada that go right across!
and a bumper bar you can sit on!
and mount the rear wiper in the glass.

I think I’ve decided no right across taillights.I’ve never liked them much. Maybe give them a quick go. But I reckon I won’t. Ithink I can come up with something better. Chrome won’t be missing though.Wiper in the glass may be a good idea.

Quote:

Originally Posted by gothefalcon

Wouldn't be the first time a company like Ford responded toa customer request... especially if they thought they could make a quid or twoout of it !
This is where the coupe-utility idea was born out of.... (A customer request...not AFF)

I've owned 6 Falcon Wagons over the years... got a few years left in me yet, soI will need to update a few more times before I'm done...

Quote:

Originally Posted by gothefalcon

I might be only one voice... but I'm sure there would be enough others... ifford were to build it right !

A fella can live in hope, right??? Nothing wrong with that !

If they do respond, and make the wagon,that’ll be fantastic. But even if they don’t, we can see another version ofwhat the Falcon wagon could look like. And I can stare at it wishing it wasreal.

Quote:

Originally Posted by prydey

drop the ride height, bit ofcolour coding and tint and some tasteful rims

Quote:

Originally Posted by prydey

its sitting down a bit more in the bum'cause its choc full of luggage.

i never had a problem with the old shape.

That wagon looks awesome! Those mods aregreat. Colour coding looks awesome, one reason I like our AUII Futura, I likethe colour coded strips. I like the old shape too. It’s very well designed Ireckon.

Quote:

Originally Posted by prydey

chris - for practicality (none of this form over function stuff)i would suggest steering away from the sloping roofline of sportwagon/libertytype wagons and keep the large rear opening of the previous falcon wagon. ifitted a 8kg washing machine in the back of mine. wouldn't have a hope offitting in a sportwagon, and probably pushing it in a territory even.

also keep the reasonable rear overhang. keep reasonable length to the storagearea. afterall, that is what a wagon is all about.

i would guess that many sportwagons are sold simply because its a differentbody style, not because its a wagon. IF (and thats a big if) Ford were toconsider the wagon at a later stage, it would be suicide to go down the samepath as holden. need to keep it a REAL wagon.

No, no sloping roofline. I’m not going nearthat. This will be a full size wagon, bigger than the last (not hugely though),but I want to design it to look awesome too. This will be a real wagon. Nothingless. Maybe more. ;)

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mr Hardware

It Seems A Wagon That Is Practical And A Wagon That Sells Are Mutually Exclusive

I reckon I can prove that wrong.

OffRoadFalcon · 08-11-2011, 11:22 AM

Thanks for all the suggestions guys, keep them coming!

OffRoadFalcon · 08-11-2011, 01:57 PM

Forgot to mention before, but I intend to show Ford Australia electronic copies of my designs when I'm happy with them. Whether they will take much notice of them I'm unsure. But showing them my ideas can't hurt.

Road_Warrior · 08-11-2011, 02:43 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by CarsAreMyLife

Forgot to mention before, but I intend to show Ford Australia electronic copies of my designs when I'm happy with them. Whether they will take much notice of them I'm unsure. But showing them my ideas can't hurt.

I'm sure there's one or two members on here who could facilitate that for you

madwag · 08-11-2011, 03:43 PM

it could be a big ask but the i think a 2 way tailgate and wind down window of old would be awesome!

haha i will understand if its to hard

OffRoadFalcon · 08-11-2011, 03:55 PM

Gothefalcon offered to send my designs to the R & D guys at Ford. Wouldn't mind sending it myself though. Email or something?

Madwag, I like that one! I can do that, Opening up like the previous wagons, or just half goes up, and the bottom half down. Wind down window would be awesome! I'll have to write out a big list of features haha. I'm only going to do exterior designs, and they'll be with the boot closed, but I'll make it obvious that it is a two way. I'll have to give all that some thought though, I'm noticing complications.................................. ok, I've solved them.

Thanks guys. I'll probably wait a few more days for more suggestions, and then start the drawings, just got to keep away from that pencil.