A descent Ford sports car?

[Van D]

Well my sister has been in Europe for about a month, and whilst she's been gone, i've been driving her Toyota Celica on the odd occasion (shh). I've no idea on these cars at all, but I do know it's a pretty much standard '98 model, and that's about it (no GTS type of thing or whatever they are).
What I also know, is that it kicks the crap out of every Ford i've owned or driven (including BA/BF and AU's) in terms of handling and feel on the road. You can throw this thing into any corner any which way you wish and it sticks without fail.

So it got me thinking, I know Ford has, erm, tried, with the Cougar and what not over the years. But I was wondering what people on here would think if Ford made a descent sports car/coupe. Something to go with the celica's and supra's etc.

Would you buy one? I'm not talking big Falcon coupe either. Something that could use the smaller Ford cars turbo engine's or even duratech like the cougar that has power and economy. Something front wheel drive and small that hugs the road.

Just interested..

[zetec]

Drive a Focus XR5 Turbo... I don't need to say much more. It'll make the Celica look like a unicycle in comparison, has heaps of power, is a genuinely big car for its class and is the closest you'll get to a small/medium Ford with good performance and great handling.

[Bossxr8]

Celica's were never regarded as drivers cars so thats suprising. They were hairdressers cars. Ford used to have the Puma that was Europe only and that was highly regarded but no longer sold. Sports coupes are basically non existant now- Celica, MR2, Supra, Integra, Cougar, Probe, MX6, 200SX all dead. Its a dead market.

[Van D]

Originally Posted by Bossxr8

Celica's were never regarded as drivers cars so thats suprising. They were hairdressers cars. Ford used to have the Puma that was Europe only and that was highly regarded but no longer sold. Sports coupes are basically non existant now- Celica, MR2, Supra, Integra, Cougar, Probe, MX6, 200SX all dead. Its a dead market.

Yeah that's why I was surprised about it too, always been told of the celica's been hairdressers cars (you feel like one driving it though :togo: ). Definitely felt waay better on the road though than the falcons. You can definitely tell it's no real 'sports' car though.

I would have thought with the likes of the new skyline and what not it wouldn't have been a completely dead market. Even if it weren't to be a coupe.

Though i'd always thought a sporty mondeo in coupe form would look the goods



Something about that car in a two door version sits nice.

I'm not big on small Fords, so excuse my ignorance. But there is a coupe in the next gen focus models right? Are they coming here?

[Powdered Toast Man]

Originally Posted by Van D

Yeah that's why I was surprised about it too, always been told of the celica's been hairdressers cars (you feel like one driving it though :togo: ). Definitely felt waay better on the road though than the falcons. You can definitely tell it's no real 'sports' car though.

The last of the Celicas was supposed to be a very good steer. Had a powerful engine for the class as well, only you had to rev the tits of it to make the most of it.

The ones before that were hairdressers cars, they were essentially Camry coupes. They had the Camry 4 cyl in them. The last model had it's own engine.

Not sure if it came out in 1999 or 1998 though. Which one does your sister have, the last shape or the mid 90's style one before with the quad headlights?

I think the coupe market dried up because the hot hatch market took off, so all of the coupes out there were axed. But like all cycles I think it's about due for a resergance in coupes, especially small ones.

[tapeworm]

The Probe was a good car in it's day with a sweet all round sporty set up.

[Allen]

Ford definatly needs a mid sized, 2 door sport coupe.

It should have a xr6t engine/small quad cam v8, 6 speed and RWD... Throw in a good chassis, looks to die for (Styled after the Aston in the other thread?) and a nice sporty feature packed interior and you have a winner...

Australia's answer to the Mustang/Camaro pony cars of the states?

The probe would have been a winner with RWD and a 5.0 shoe horned under the bonnet...

[The Stylist]

There was talk a while ago of Ford Europe bringing back the Capri, but that has seemed to of gone out the window. Ford don't have anything really, you could say the XR5 fits the bill, but thats more of an hot hatch than a coupe.

[Rev28K]

A friend drove one of the Colin Osborne Celicas at the Bathurst 12 Hr. He said that while the Honda Integra R's were better as a stockie once these race Celicas had done the springs, shocks, alignment, diff, etc they proved to be very capable race cars.

I would’ve killed for a Ford Puma Racing 5-6 years ago (and still wouldn’t mind one now).

[MRJUCY]

If Ford did a real small rwd coupe like the original Capris I'd be very interested, I tried bunch of Jap & Euro sporties when I was looking for a car & none of them had steering or handling even approaching Falcon without spending uber dollars.

[Rev28K]

Ford are good at building a base car with great handling. If they can wrap one up in a sexy body why wouldn’t it sell – what is it’s opposition? The Hyundai Tiburon?

FWD? RWD? AWD? Wouldn’t matter as long as it handled superbly.

I don’t know if they have the budget for a “vanity” project at the moment. Hasn’t the 4WD Focus Turbo been on hold for ages.

[Full Noise]

Van D. I think that you’ve well and truly over estimated the Celica by even referring to it as a sports car. The Celica was absolutely lost in the market by Toyota. One year they wanted it to be mean, the next year it would be as soft as a bag of marshmallows.

It the buyer was a mid 20 - 30’s women that wanted to look cool in front of her friends, then the Celica may have suited, but in my opinion, any bloke that buys one of these cars thinking that it’s some pseudo Ferrari has either a tender grip on reality, or a problem with his sexuality.

Ford do make some great sports cars, although they’re not really available to the masses.

My 2.2 cents, GST included.

[Van D]

Originally Posted by Full Noise

Van D. I think that you’ve well and truly over estimated the Celica by even referring to it as a sports car. The Celica was absolutely lost in the market by Toyota. One year they wanted it to be mean, the next year it would be as soft as a bag of marshmallows.

True, didn't mean for it to come out as a 'sports' car. More related to ford making one.
From celica to falcon point of few, its mainly is the body roll factor and the way it sits on the road. I've been in a supra before as well, and it's the same feeling, you're sitting a lot closer to the road and the body doesn't give as much (at least it doesn't feel like it). I mean, a big/heavy 4 door family sedan versus a small two door coupe and the falc already is behind in the handling department IMO.

The sisters celica is far from sports in the performance compartment I agree. Though when it gets higher in revs it still goes pretty well for a 10 year old chicks car.

I'd love to see a more dumbed down version of the GT40 Though driving one might be different!

[blackers10]

the TRUE Ford sports car is a GT40 full stop
BIG motor..wicked handling and aerodynamics etc

but sadly.. are WAY overpriced for aussies to buy

werent all the hi power(GTR,supra,evo etc) japanese imports priced in the same area as the GT40 and corvette and M3 etc

so depends which price bracket your aiming at

[Powdered Toast Man]

Aren't the new Evo and WRX STi both priced around the 80K mark? Isn't a GT40 more like 150K and up against the likes of Ferraris and Lambos?

I think Van D is a bit like me Full Noise. I have owned nothing but Falcons, and driven pretty much nothing but family cars for my driving life. So when I jump in a little 4 pot they feel zippy to drive. I don't think he's saying the Celica is a great drive, just that it surprised him. And if he hasn't spent much time behind the wheel of this sort of car then he doesn't have much to compare it to. Only the big cumbersome family car, or some crappy old 4 pot that has no guts.

He's not saying it's a Ferrari competitor either so you dont have to worry about him wanting to drag a GT40 in his sisters celica :eclipsee_

I would love a RWD mid size coupe (Celica, Prelude size) thats powered by a small capacity alloy V8. That way I get the sportiness plus that sound

[blackers10]

that would be one of those bullet cars that are at the motor show??
MX5 body
RWD
Lexus 4ltr V8

[Powdered Toast Man]

Yeah, I would love a Bullet. I'm not sure if they still build them.
There were 2 versions IIRC, the Bullet with the 4L Lexus V8 and the Bullet SS with a supercharged 4L Lexus V8. I think there was a rotory planned as well.

[Full Noise]

Originally Posted by Powdered Toast Man

Yeah, I would love a Bullet. I'm not sure if they still build them.
There were 2 versions IIRC, the Bullet with the 4L Lexus V8 and the Bullet SS with a supercharged 4L Lexus V8. I think there was a rotory planned as well.

She was a serious bit of gear. I was looking at the same engine for my project car, but ended up settling for a Boss 260.

Here’s a link. High res images available on the page.

http://www.fastlane.com.au/Custom_Shed/AEC_Bullet.htm

[Allen]

The bullet raises a very good point...

Why doesn't Ford have a Sports Roadster??

You would think with Australia's climate (Maybe not Melbourne lol) that roadsters would be more popular...

[Rev28K]

That would’ve been the Capri.

For a cheapy how about a StreetKa – Ka convertible with a more modern engine.

Ford faces serious internal competition from the world’s best-selling roadster – the Mazda MX5/Miata.

For a sports car I’d rather that it was cheap and nimble as a first priority.

GM are going to be building a lot of small RWD platforms which gives them a bit of a head start when building a cheap sports car (Solstice).

While I’ve no doubt that Ford have the capability to do it, they need to get their house (mainstream models) in order first.

What is the point of building one of the worlds best sports cars if your profits are gobbled up by not building family cars or minivans that people want to buy?

[5L]

driven a celica, been up in the hills followed by a celica trust me my old eb, with superlows's, whiteline swaybars, 17's slotted brakes felt alot better on the road than a celica and alot safer in the hills (atleast the front gripped at high speeds- and rear didnt for some fun). after 2-3 corners in the hills the celica was not keeping up at all.

i think the words sports car and front wheel drive look shocking in the same sentence, we all know real cars are driven by the rear wheels no matter the size of the car if you want a hairdressers car that will flog a celica but with enough glam so you dont look out of place when you go the the blokes only bars dressed as one of the village people, but can still actually be called a car go see mazda and suss out a mx5.

[Rev28K]

Originally Posted by AUXR8220

i think the words sports car and front wheel drive look shocking in the same sentence, we all know real cars are driven by the rear wheels no matter the size of the car

All depends really drive a good one and you’ll be surprised. A friend of a friend was shifting from sports sedans and carts and was thinking about a FWD series, he’d never raced a FWD before and wanted to see what my car was like out on the track. Wound up being a second quicker than me and his times embarrassed a lot of gruntier RWD competitors. I’ll be a happy man when I match his times.

Nissan are keen to revive their fondly-remembered Silvia model line, Mazda have shown a baby 2+1 RWD coupe, Toyota have a small RWD platform (IS/Altezza) and there have been rumours about a new AE86 coupe If you really hate FWD then swing them around so that they are RWD e.g. Audi transverse FWD 4 cylinder powers the mid-engined Yes! roadster.

[winovin]

What is a descent sports car? One that is on the decline?

[TUF_302]

The XR5 Focus, or even the XR4 Fiesta!, both go really well and handle like they are on rails!! But we all know sports cars are for girls, muscle or high performance for us falcon lovers!

[Raptor]

Shock horror, who knew :

A hairdressers car (Celica) could make a Falcon feel like a, um, well, you know a taxi :

Perhaps you'd prefer something like this; Concept Ford Focus Coupe

Ford have many alternatives, just pick your price/excitement level;
Fiesta, Focus, Mondeo, Mustang, GT40 ;)

[Hunter]

I don't know why people compare Falcons to sports cars... Falcons are essentially 'sports sedans' that are built to have a bit of go, maybe a little better handling than usual if its an XR and comfortable. If you want a sports car with a sports feel and to have a blue oval on it, then I guess you couldn't go past a GT (no not a GT Falcon, an actual Ford GT) or maybe a mustang.

Anyway its funny you should mention the Celica - out of all the cars in Forza2 its actually one the worst handling ones there, it just farking plows through turns like a lump of hot steel in a vat of butter (this not a compliment btw). I spent ages last night trying to the stupid thing to hold the road. From what I've heard and read about Forza2, the cars are quite similar to their real world counterparts, hopefully the real sillycar isn't as bad else holy shiiiii that sucks.

[uranium_death]

Ford Australia should not waste their time with sports cars.

People who want sports cars go for prestige badges. Sports cars are often a lifestyle vehicle and people want to be seen in a vehicle with a prestigious badge.

Can buy a Capri for the same cost as a slab of VB. Explains why so many people like them!

[flappist]

Originally Posted by uranium_death

Ford Australia should not waste their time with sports cars.

People who want sports cars go for prestige badges. Sports cars are often a lifestyle vehicle and people want to be seen in a vehicle with a prestigious badge.

Can buy a Capri for the same cost as a slab of VB. Explains why so many people like them!

Yep. The largest selling sports car in Australia, the Mazda MX5 which stock standard will blow away 99% of all FPVs included modded ones on a tight windy technical track like for example Lakeside.

Very prestigious brand that one.

If ford did make a sports car and sell it in Aistralia like the Probe, Couger or Mustang most of YOU would shun it because it would not have stripes, a bulge in the bonnet or a big V8 and did not win a race on a mountain 40,000 years ago......

[uranium_death]

The MX-5 is a global brand.

Not many Ford sports cars have worked over borders.

Something special will need to occur otherwise.

[Van D]

Originally Posted by uranium_death

The MX-5 is a global brand.

Not many Ford sports cars have worked over borders.

Something special will need to occur otherwise.

But Ford is becoming a global brand. That's why I thought it might be an idea to even base something on a solid platform that could go global.

Raptor - From people feedback on the majority of alternatives you listed, they're nothing like what i'm talking about AND aren't necessarily great cars.

Hunter - Though i've never driven one personally (there are people on the boards who have though), the mustang would hardly be classed as a solid car. And no offence, but driving a car in a video has absolutely nothing to do with real life driving, no matter how 'realistic' they make the cars. And if the celica is so bad then, it shows how crap the larger cars are (which is understandable, i'm not questioning that, i'm asking if anyone would buy a smaller sports car made by ford).