Advice on audi a4 v subaru wagons

starkersEB · 23-02-2012, 06:35 PM

I know I know this is a ford forum but..

I am looking at getting a new (secondhand) car and have a budget of 10 ish grand.

I had settled on a forrester/liberty/outback 1999-2003 era, but just noticed the audi a4 wagon of the same era is around the same price or even cheaper with a lot more kit.

I dont want to get into a money pit so..

The question is. Are audis as expensive to run as im lead to believe or about the same as the subies.

Ps.. I would love to get my bum back into a ford but unfortunatly ford dont really offer anything in that kind of market/price.

Cheers in advance

falconnut · 23-02-2012, 06:44 PM

So your looking for a AWD?

Why not something cheaper to run (all euro cars are renowned for high cost of ownership) like a territory or even a rav/kluger ?

I would personally get a subi, just dont expect them to be cheap to fix either.

starkersEB · 23-02-2012, 07:14 PM

AWD isnt a necesity just a mid sized wagon is what im after. Would love a terri, but finances wouldnt stretch that far. Same with kluger. and as for rav4 dont you have to cash in your testicles when the car gets signed over to you? ;)

Auslandau · 23-02-2012, 07:24 PM

I would go for the Audi everytime over the Subaru. Bit of snobbery comes into BUT have had Audi's and they really are a great car and have again been looking at them for a runaround they are very good value for money. Compare also to a VW ...... they are the same car and sometimes cheaper.

Yes they are a little bit more to fix if required but if serviced well, belts changed when they should have been they will go for ever.

Subaru's really are a very boring looking car but I am sure are good but apart from 1 model are relegated to the appliance brigade ........ seeing as you are asking for opinions. Never owned one though so cant really say what they are like for servicing etc

blueoval · 23-02-2012, 07:46 PM

This is a good thread. I will be in a similar position hopefully later this year for a mid sized wagon, 4 cyl. Not necessarily a AWD either, but wanted something with a bit of class but can still fit my bike in the back if need be. (front wheel off of course). I have had a 2000 Liberty wagon before and miss the versatility of it, but would like to get either a VW or Audi instead for something different.

If it were me, I'd be going the Audi/VW option. The A4/A3 wagon or hatch variant would be good. Some come with turbo, others NA. The VW you can get the Golf wagon, Jetta Im unsure if it comes in a wagon, or a Passat wagon is an option, albeit about the same size as a Subaru wagon I reckon.

The Audi like Auslandau said has that badge snobbery side to it, but so does VW to a smaller extent.

The Subaru for servicing was as pricey but not as often. I found it had far less issues to my Ford, less issues to deal with, no electronic problems and was all round a genuinely reliable car. I owned mine for 3 years and all I did was the regular maintenance and servicing to the log book. The engine ran perfect. I suspect the Audi/VW would be similar.

mrghia · 23-02-2012, 08:14 PM

older VW's are not that good from what im told buy a VW mechanic.
Forresters are good seem to units fairly reliable as well.
but itss up to you really i'd make sure its got a solid service history.
What about a GAS BA wagon?

Spammy · 23-02-2012, 08:46 PM

Subi every time - Audi will put you in the poor house before you blink.

Geez Louise · 23-02-2012, 08:52 PM

I would go the Audi everytime but then again I am partial to them...especially the A5 model

The A4's seem good from what I have seen of them.

Yes Audi's can be a bit pricey to service, (but overall not too bad) but they are a great little piece of luxury. Subaru's can be pretty expensive for parts too...So I guess it comes down to a much of a muchness...Which one do you like better?

Cheers
Col

4.0i OHC · 23-02-2012, 08:53 PM

You'll have more fun driving the Audi, so I'd probably go for that option. The Audis of the time had a quality interior and some great four cylinder engines (the 90 degree V6s are lacklustre, though). The Subaru will most likely be boring to both drive and look at, and it's not like the Subaru servicing will be cheap.

Spammy · 23-02-2012, 10:13 PM

Audi parts are not cheap and need to buy them often, Subi parts are not cheap but you rarely need to buy them. Audi will have wierd electrical issues which are hard to find and fix. Subi will give years of faithful but sort of unexciting service (like most japanese cars).

Why do you think 2nd had Audis are so cheap??

smoo · 23-02-2012, 10:27 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Spammy

Why do you think 2nd had Audis are so cheap??

Because of illinformed people parroting mythical BS like you posted above.

OP have you also considered Volvo V70, Peugeot 406 (manual!), Mercedes 230TE. Alfa 2.0 156 (again, manual)... VW Passat are essentially the same car with different badge and most likely a bit cheaper on the used market.
And do remember if you go Euro buy out of Europe for parts.

starkersEB · 23-02-2012, 11:54 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by smoo

Because of illinformed people parroting mythical BS like you posted above.

OP have you also considered Volvo V70, Peugeot 406 (manual!), Mercedes 230TE. Alfa 2.0 156 (again, manual)... VW Passat are essentially the same car with different badge and most likely a bit cheaper on the used market.
And do remember if you go Euro buy out of Europe for parts.

Nah I have not, but will have a look. Thanks for the heads up.

I currently own a citroen (albeit a van) and have actually found servicing and parts prettymuch same same with the local makes. But it is a pretty baisic machine

Spammy · 23-02-2012, 10:16 PM

We used to have a 2002 Forrester and loved it. We switched to a 2007 Territory - worst discision ever. Will be switchng back to a Subi very soon.

Olbucko · 25-02-2012, 12:51 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Spammy

We used to have a 2002 Forrester and loved it. We switched to a 2007 Territory - worst discision ever. Will be switchng back to a Subi very soon.

I bought a 2002 Forrester which I thought was a good car untill I bought a 2007 Territory, the handling, steering, and the performance of the Ford is steets ahead.
However the Forrester is the most reliable car that I have ever owned, it has now gone nearly 400,000 km, apart from breaking 3 sway bars, a front wheel bearing, and bursting a radiator, little else has ever gone wrong. The electrical system, including starter and alternator, engine, auto transmission, steering, and diffs have never been touched. It has been serviced regularly and had parts like timing belts, shocks, brake pads and rotors replaced as required.
For all it's life it has seen at least 120 km of dirt road a week. Parts are not that expensive and it's not a difficult car to work on yourself. The only expensive service comes every 100,000 km when the timing belt has to be replaced.
If you could find one with about 150k on the clock that had been serviced regularly it would be hard to go wrong

I cant imagine an Audi being that reliable or being able to maintain it youself

I still have my Territory, now with 170,000 km on the clock and am still happy with it.

Spammy · 25-02-2012, 10:39 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by RPI

I bought a 2002 Forrester which I thought was a good car untill I bought a 2007 Territory, the handling, steering, and the performance of the Ford is steets ahead.
.

I might be happier with our territory if it didn't have rust issues from the day it was delivered, if it didn't look like the trim was fitted by blind people (apologies to blind people>> I"m sure you could do a better job than Ford)
and I might also like my territory more if I didn't have to deal with a Ford Dealer to buy it and get the warranty issues sorted.

Yellow_Festiva · 23-02-2012, 10:42 PM

My sis is selling her A4 sedan. I think its an 02 or 03 model. Pretty low kays and well serviced but when stuff breaks its not cheap. She has the CVT box and I'm not a fan of how it work.

The engine is starting to play up. I wouldn't touch a used Euro unless it was from original owner with full, correct service history.

**Polyal** · 23-02-2012, 10:50 PM

The audi carries a bigger risk, its just a fact. If you find one thats been looked after 100% then you might get lucky. Ive got mixed experiences, one mate had a v6 a6 and clocked up 350,000ks no worries. But when things broke it costed heaps, and thats if the garage diagnoses it correctly in a timely matter. You can take them back to audi but pack the ky.

Subbies can be the same, another friend with a turbo xt has had many diff and gbox issues and its stock as a rock.

With used cars it will come down to the history and what kind of person owned it before.

$10k is a hard price to play with...enough to get something decent, but perhaps not enough to make a safe desicion. What are your requirements exactly?

**Polyal** · 23-02-2012, 10:54 PM

If you are going mid size for cost reason, and i mean running costs, then i would look at getting a really clean b series wagon and putting a upmarket lpg system on it. You miss the b series diff bush issue with the wagon aswell.

Id be keen to find a series 3 au sr wagon and go svi aswell...my au costs less to run than our barina.

Dont know what your situation is like, but i too could of taken a risk with a "newer/better" car...but fact is that price range is hard to get right. For me the au is around just until i get settled next year and then can upgrade...its doing a bloody good job though.

starkersEB · 23-02-2012, 11:46 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Polyal

If you are going mid size for cost reason, and i mean running costs, then i would look at getting a really clean b series wagon and putting a upmarket lpg system on it. You miss the b series diff bush issue with the wagon aswell.

Id be keen to find a series 3 au sr wagon and go svi aswell...my au costs less to run than our barina.

Dont know what your situation is like, but i too could of taken a risk with a "newer/better" car...but fact is that price range is hard to get right. For me the au is around just until i get settled next year and then can upgrade...its doing a bloody good job though.

My wife and I are trying to start a family, so my 2 seater van will be useless for kids. But my job as a painter I sometimes need to carry some gear (not all the time) and also my dog, so hence the wagon. Honestly I just cant get exited about a falcon wagon, not sure why seeing i love the b series sedan and usually a fan of wagons. I think because you know Ford just didnt give a damn and it shows. Same with the commondoors.

Like you said $10k sucks. too much to go oh bugger it that will do, but not enough to get a near-new low kayer!!

I am thinking screw it all and going Focus/Fiesta or even suzuki swift. at least ill get something less than 10 years old

Auslandau · 23-02-2012, 10:54 PM

Yes .... only way to buy anything Euro is that it really must come with full service history. For the Audi, if over 100,000 must have had the belts replaced (expensive) and every 100,000 after that. Fully maintained and the little electrical gremlins kept in check no probs for long term happiness

Had ours for 5 years and was serviced by Audi. Normal servicing and bits and pieces was not really that much more than the Fords but little weird things can cost. RWC time when I sold it .... a front driving light had a crack. $500.00 later just for that bit. BUT the total bill was $1,000 give or take a few $$ for everything to be done including a new windscreen. Was very happy with that

Also sold it to very close to what I paid for it 5 years prior.

SumoDog68 · 23-02-2012, 11:05 PM

Subarus are one of the most reliable cars on the market and Audi one of the least reliable . If reliabilty does not feature highly then Audi does have nicer interior - personally i prefer Fuji Heavy ...

blueoval · 24-02-2012, 11:34 AM

The thought of a focus or a jap hatch of some kind also appeals. It will still be cheap to run, carry things ok, and still be able to throw the kids in the back.

There is always a trade off with Euro cars from what I have found. Bigger buying price, nicer build quality, bigger maintenance bill, higher resale value.

Aussie cars, cheaper to buy, average maintenance costs, lowest resale value.

Again, have you thought about looking at a VW golf?
http://www.carsales.com.au/private/d...age:Min,100000

4.0i OHC · 24-02-2012, 01:07 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by blueoval

The thought of a focus or a jap hatch of some kind also appeals. It will still be cheap to run, carry things ok, and still be able to throw the kids in the back.

There is always a trade off with Euro cars from what I have found. Bigger buying price, nicer build quality, bigger maintenance bill, higher resale value.

Aussie cars, cheaper to buy, average maintenance costs, lowest resale value.

Again, have you thought about looking at a VW golf?
http://www.carsales.com.au/private/d...age:Min,100000

Not a bad car but definitely overshadowed by the excellent LR Focus.

Spammy · 24-02-2012, 11:46 AM

Depending on how tall you and your wife are think about size of car and ease of fitting rear facing baby capsules. We found our Forrester was a bit tight and had to put the baby capsule behind the passenger seat, which blocked the seat from going all the way back. IIRc not a problem with Liberty wagons - was a prob with my buddies Audi A4.

Dr Smith · 24-02-2012, 01:30 PM

Any euro car out of warranty will be expensive to maintain at factory/authorised service centres. One reason I bought an extended factory warranty for my commercial VW.

If I were you I would try and hunt down some local mechanics that advertise ability to repair both (or any brand) you consider buying. I would visit them, tell them what you're planning to buy and ask them for some advice of potential or known issues. Mention you would like to use them for servicing to get their costs, whether they use geniune parts or reputable equivalents as well. You will get cheaper service and hopfully good advice on the pitfalls etc of what to expect.

I'd also check on any recalls your chosen vehicle may have had to ensure they have been complied with. These can only be rectified at authorised dealers. You would be surprised at how many there are for the euros, it's not often discussed and maybe the perceived better dealer serice has something to do with this.

In this case as much research as possible could save you literally $1,000's down the track,

**Polyal** · 24-02-2012, 01:54 PM

Cant say enough about research, know when the belts/chains where meant to be replaced as that can save you a bit by buying a car that was just done.

superfly · 24-02-2012, 02:57 PM

I've owned a Subaru 1993 Liberty RS, 1999 WRX, 2001 WRX. They were all good cars. My wife still has the 01 and I'm selling my 99 as I've bought the Ford.

Subaru makes great cars but servicing isn't as cheap as when I owned Hyundai's before the Subaru's. I've never owned an Audi before but I believe they are good cars. But I also believe you pay extra for the badge.

I was happy with my Subaru's but growing family dictated the need for a bigger car. We did look at Subaru's again (Outback and Forester) but compared in value to the Ford, they lost big time.

Subaru also go forever. My wife's 01 has done 185K (still on stock clutch!) and my 99 did 235K but unfortunately got a blown head gasket so it needed a new engine and it is on its fourth clutch.

Spammy · 24-02-2012, 05:24 PM

I agree that parts for euros are cheap and sort of easy over the net. However, buying parts over the net is not that practicle for your wife's daily driver when you have very young kids. I don't thnk she will be that happy being without a car for 10 days while you wait for a starter motor or coil pack to arrive in the mail.

When our kids were young we found it painful to have to drop the car off for a sevice and swap the baby seats over to the loaner car.

falconnut · 24-02-2012, 06:21 PM

Whats wrong with a 10 year old car?

a newer car can be just as thrashed or worse.

Hayden1 · 24-02-2012, 08:37 PM

Sorry if this isn't really on topic but someone said Audi, so...
My families on the second Audi right now and, for the price tag, they ARE NOT worth it. The A5 Sportback or whatever its called that is sitting in the driveway right now is in no way worth the extra 40G's over the Turbo Terri next to it. Haven't had one problem at all with the terri but the A5 is always telling you to check this, do this, change that, get serviced etc. It has spat all the coolant out overnight somehow and scrapes over anything higher than those speed humps at the shops, ripping out pieces of plastic and rubber, resulting in more trips to the Audi shop... Don't talk about the headspace in it either, especially in the back. I'm only 6ft and when I drive it my hair touches the roof which is just SOOO annoying... If thats what the driving position is like, imagine what the back seats are like (consider it was originally a coupe). The previous Audi was an A4 with the 2.4 and CVT. The 2.4 was a great engine (forgot to say the TDI in the A5 has got some nice power as well) and was really smooth but the CVT was ridiculous. The amount of times we had to ring Audi was ridiculous as well, in the end the CVT crapped itself and for some reason we ended up getting another Audi...

Oh yea, wtf is with the brake dust on them

edit...
Our BA Falcon isn't any better considering the problems people have had, luckily our 4spd is still going good but the hand brake has a mind of its own